Question--selling "Facebook size" downloads online

[boxofrocks]

I've had some comments from football parents that lead me to believe that my online print business is falling off because so few people keep prints anymore. She asked about selling downloads.

Smugmug had a low res and hi res download option available, and I may be able to create both in EM.

Assuming I sell a 4x6 football print online for $5, what do you think is a fair price for a low res download? They wouldn't be suitable for printing, but they be the same size as the Facebook photos do after they're uploaded (long side is about 600 px), and have no watermarks of any kind on them.

I don't want to completely kill my print business my making them too cheap, but don't know if it's fair to charge the same price.


I may also be able to sell Hi res, but those would be considerably more expensive.

Thanks for your thoughts.

[OTRphoto]

The advice I've seen on this type of stuff is to sell it at the same cost you would a print of the same size. So if it would print at a 4x6 size - sell it at the same $5 you charge for the 4x6.

I would keep the res low though so that if they do print it larger - they won't like the quality and ask for a larger print :)

[toverman]

I bet some people will try to print the low-res version (grandma isn't always on Facebook or has e-mail). You might consider sizing it big enough for a 4x6 print but charging more because it gives people free reign to mint their own 4x6 prints.

[boxofrocks]

Originally Posted by OTRphoto

The advice I've seen on this type of stuff is to sell it at the same cost you would a print of the same size...

I would keep the res low though so that if they do print it larger - they won't like the quality and ask for a larger print :)

That's the rub, isn't it? If I sell close to 4x6 resolution, they can print 5x7s or maybe even 8x10 in some cases and have them look OK by most consumer's eyes.

I'm stumped on this.

boxofrocks added 1 Minutes and 44 Seconds later...Double Post Merged Below

Originally Posted by toverman

I bet some people will try to print the low-res version (grandma isn't always on Facebook or has e-mail). You might consider sizing it big enough for a 4x6 print but charging more because it gives people free reign to mint their own 4x6 prints.

True, but then they say "I only want to put it on FB--why should I pay more"? You know the uneducated consumer, and their's little use in trying to educate most of them.

Keep the opinions coming.

[lyncca]

I saw a photographer that gives a low-res version of any prints bought for facebook. I thought it was a good idea, then you have the print money and they can put it online. I figure they can just scan it anyway, so you might as well give it to them and make it look how you want instead of them mangling the image.

I don't just give low-res files anymore. I was doing that with my copyright on them, but found that people didn't buy any prints when they had them. They didn't care if they were watermarked or not. Then, they would try to print the web-ready images and they looked like crap and it looked like it was my image that was bad.

Now, if they want to pay the money for high-res files, I will do that, but it will cost 'em!

[CaptainTom]

I've added the lo res facebook image to my ala carte list.
I'll have to check the stats but I don't think I've sold any...

http://tomthompson.exposuremanager.com

check Hill School Dance for example


Edit: sold three only. 4X5 sell 2 to 1 over 4X6 ?

[boxofrocks]

Maybe $9.95 is too much for a low res download? I dunno.

It's all about perceived value by the customer, isn't it? I can promise you that my images are scanned, because I see them on FB now. I had an "honest" parent ask me about this. Here was part of her email:

i do think you would get quite a bit more orders if you could make lower cost digital downloads available...we hardly use hard copies anymore, and sharing photos is what they all do now...just a thought.

Sure, but at what expense to print sales, and what price point?

I could put language on the website letting them know the FB size DLs will make lousy prints, but offer more "flexibility" for the client. Maybe that's a fair trade off to them, and they could be the same price as a 4x6.

[ronocnikral]

I would make it a web quality download, about 4x6 size at like 72 dpi. and i would charge what you would for a print. the parent indicated the hard copies are dead...since they don't plan on using it for printing, I would make it web quality.

I also like the idea of qualifying what it is for. I would just leave it at, "these prints are for the purposes of sharing via email, social networking etc." That way if they print and come back, you can ask them why they are printing.

[boxofrocks]

Here's the feedback I got from the Mom that inquired about it. I asked her (a previous Senior Portrait customer) what she'd be willing to pay for them. Don't you wish they were all like that?

Still not sure it's the right answer, but I'm leaning that way.

I would price them as a 4x6...since they aren't printable, i'd say people would be willing to pay what they would pay for a 4x6 to legally post these pics on their fb page. obviously the kids don't even care if there are watermarks on them...since for years i've seen them posted...i'm sure they don't consider it stealing from you, but it is...however, if you gave them the option to be legit, it might help at least a little with people hijacking your photos! and you might actually get paid for what they are posting...


as i said, i'm a rule follower, and have told my kids they cannot post those pics unless we had permission from you...


i also think that maybe you need to have the booster club send out a reminder that posting your pics w/out permission is illegal...then give them the info on how to do it legally...maybe it's more complicated than this...but i'm just trying to find a solution...


hope this helps...

[mmuhlenkamp]

I think pricing them as a 4X6 is good (but no more than 500-700 pixels on the long end), maybe if someone buys a few prints you'll include the web-size images as a "bonus", but if they ONLY want to buy the web image they have that option as well.

[boxofrocks]

Originally Posted by mmuhlenkamp

I think pricing them as a 4X6 is good (but no more than 500-700 pixels on the long end), maybe if someone buys a few prints you'll include the web-size images as a "bonus", but if they ONLY want to buy the web image they have that option as well.

Nice idea, but execution may be challenging unless it's done "manually".

Now if it could be included automatically, that would be sweet (emailing exposure manager...)

[Cajungaltx]

How about making it part of a package?

I don't sell full rez files. Period.

But - I do offer clients access to a mid rez file, with the purchase of a package. The package gets them the prints they purchased images of - with personal printing rights of 4x6's.

So say someone buys a 5x7 from you at $12 - do an 'add on' of that image for $3 for a low rez download of the image.

To buy the Low Rez (btw, I don't say 'low resolution' - I use 'mid rez' - suggested by the Sallee's out of Dallas a couple years ago) file, it's the cost of the print, if they don't want the print.

Don't cut your throat (printing profit).... if your going to offer it... make sure your profit is the same. One good thing... is that there is 'zero' out of pocket for that format. ;)

[HotHolly]

I have a suggestion for you. I kinda understand this parent type, and at the same time, they drive me nuts. Im bombarded with things from the kids school to buy on a weekly basis. School photo paks are almost $40 for 2 5x7s. That guys shoots the kids about 5x each year. Then they have this tee shirt and that one, and it just never stops.

Here is my advice to you. Make it stop and make it simple.

Add up the amount a parent typically spends over the course of the season. Get your average amount spent per child or per family. You can set it up either way. Parents from previous seasons should already know what they spent last year.

Take that number to determine the price and create a season photo pak. Figure your S&H and printing costs for last season per child. Offer a small discount for the pak and an incentive - like the files. Set up your rules and restrictions so they cant steal too much time.

I would make the pak appear discounted (eg, digital files per image are usually $15 ea. <-- The file should ALWAYS cost way more than the print, b/c it flames all your residual sales fm that image.

And then Id swap things over to digital. I know - gasp! (Im usually anti selling the negs).

But if you are making $5 per print, I think your profit margin will be better by selling the files and files only. Look at how much money you are spending on S&H and printing.

Increase your print prices for those who dont pre purchase the pak. Dont reward stragglers. Reward the early birds. Do things to encourage the pak purchase. Like the facebook images, or digital negs, are only $5 more with the pak for the WHOLE SEASON. Something unmistakably a great deal.

Make sure you write that the facebook images reg price is $5 per image, and the negs are $15 per image - by offering a preseason pak of X number of images - they save about 70% off and GET everything just by making the decision ahead of time.

Id buy it in a second. It takes the PITA part of buying school/ sports shots out of it for me and i can pick what i want and id pay the same amount of money that i did last year, but get more crap. people LOVE getting more crap for free!!!

In the mean time, your profit margin should go up, due to the lack of printing and S&H bills (as I suspect most people wont buy prints if they can get the file).

Just make sure your prices are solid or you'll shoot yourself in the foot.

If thats Greek, PM me for a clearer version. You'd be using the refillable mug concept here (people buy a $12 mug to buy $6 worth of soda over the lifetime of the mug, and then they purchase an additional $5 worth of candy every time they come in to get their free refill). Its a no brainer as long as its set up with the KISS method in mind and determine your price points based on your sales goals.

[boxofrocks]

Originally Posted by Cajungaltx

One good thing... is that there is 'zero' out of pocket for that format. ;)

not if you sell them through a 3rd party--they still take a cut.

[Cajungaltx]

Originally Posted by boxofrocks

not if you sell them through a 3rd party--they still take a cut.

Interesting - I'd find a way to sell digital files directly - there is plenty of software out there that you can buy the actual software to setup that process on your own server.