Print order deadline

[Fireball]

I have private galleries for clients to order prints/merchandise but was wondering if I should only make them available for a certain amount of time? And if so, why? Is it just to encourage them to place an order so I get my profit sooner or is it to make room for other clients? I don't have enough clients yet to really justify taking the gallery down after three months or so. I'm not sure what I would tell a client as to why I "need" to take it down without looking like I'm "forcing" them to buy within a certain amount of time.

Also, if there is a deadline for the gallery to be up then what if they want to order more in the future? How would I then make that available when I don't have a studio? I also don't sell CDs of images.

[Tom]

Most of the time, I have seen that people that do private galleries and count on print sales will put them up for 2 weeks, then take them down. You can pay X amount to keep them up longer and it costs X amount to put a gallery back up later.

I'm not sure what I would tell a client as to why I "need" to take it down without looking like I'm "forcing" them to buy within a certain amount of time.

Server space/bandwidth costs you money.

I keep mine up for all time on Smugmug, but most of my galleries are locked or hidden.

[WarrenG]

Charrie,

For portrait sessions, Seniors, etc... 2 weeks is good. I always have a minimum purchase for any session, and charge for that up front with the session fee's. The client is issued a one time coupon code to use on their gallery and in almost every case, they spend more than the minimum purchase they got because they choose to buy a CD (I have no issue with selling the images, they are just not cheap) or additional prints. If they spend over X, I usually throw in a free gift....

I agree with what Thomas said... I pay by the amount of images that I have on the site and the bandwidth used. I have never had a problem after explaining that to the client, and providing them the option to pay for the space to keep them up longer.

W

[HotHolly]

Originally Posted by Fireball

1. should only make them available for a certain amount of time?
2. And if so, why? ...
3. get my profit sooner

Three major questions.

1. Online proofing is evil. I wouldnt post them at all.

2. Because it shoots your sales in the foot. Its not a fatal shot like in the head, they will usually buy something online, but you're hemorrhaging profit by GIVING them access to the photos without buying the photos.

3. Profits are better made by selling to the client in person. They have questions that need to be answered, and without you there, they default to assumptions, error, and the judgment of non-experts.

The only thing we put online now is wedding coverage, and the only reason it goes up is so outa town folks can buy it. And even so, the online gallery does not get posted until the in town guests have had a chance to order in person. And the online gallery is only up for 10 days. (Id do 5 days, but Mike thinks thats too short). Portrait sessions do not go online - ever.

Truth be told, its more than bandwidth and time to me. Its the fact that I have no idea what they are seeing. A whacked monitor can makes some very fine work look horrid. Plus they can use some guidance in what products they should choose and how to use/ arrange what they are buying. Without you, they guess at all that stuff. And obviously, my main thing is referenced in #2 above.

[my3peas]

My galleries are available for 5 days only (I'm moving it to 3 days in July). In my experience, I've found that 2 weeks is too long for them to purchase and the initial excitment is gone. If they need a longer amount of time, I charge a $50 republishing fee for another 3 days.

Personally, I don't think you need to explain why you choose to do your galleries that way, but I do think that they need to know up front that this is the way you do it.

As additional sales go, I have to say that I don't get many. I also make it clear in my contract that the images are kept on file for 30 days after their gallery is posted.

What are you using for your gallery hosting?

[Fireball]

I'm using smugmug so I just pay the yearly fee and have unlimited space so there's no need to worry about running out of room. I'm a big newbie, maybe 1-2 shoots a month, so I don't really have a need to take them down sooner so that's why I was wondering what I would tell a client. As it stands I'm telling them their gallery stays up for 3 mos. and then comes down. I do like the idea of charging them for putting the gallery back up but again, I wouldn't know how to collect that money since I don't accept credit cards. That would mean meeting with them again and getting another check.

I'm a location photographer only and have not come to the point of meeting again afterwards and showing them their pics on my laptop. I'm still learning the salesman part of this business and find it a bit uncomfortable "pressuring" people into buying prints, etc. I used to do a shoot for $200 or less and give them all the edited photos on a CD and that was the end of it. I quit doing that this year, but am still learning all the rest of it.

[Fireball]

I'm using smugmug so I just pay the yearly fee and have unlimited space so there's no need to worry about running out of room. I'm a big newbie, maybe 1-2 shoots a month, so I don't really have a need to take them down sooner so that's why I was wondering what I would tell a client. As it stands I'm telling them their gallery stays up for 3 mos. and then comes down. I do like the idea of charging them for putting the gallery back up but again, I wouldn't know how to collect that money since I don't accept credit cards. That would mean meeting with them again and getting another check.

I'm a location photographer only and have not come to the point of meeting again afterwards and showing them their pics on my laptop. I'm still learning the salesman part of this business and find it a bit uncomfortable "pressuring" people into buying prints, etc. I used to do a shoot for $200 or less and give them all the edited photos on a CD and that was the end of it. I quit doing that this year, but am still learning all the rest of it.

[STP Images]

Originally Posted by HotHolly

Online proofing is evil. I wouldnt post them at all.

+1

I shoot events in addition to portraits (about 6 to 8 a month). I DO post my event photos online and keep them up for about 4 weeks. I hand out business cards with my personal unique URL to my proofing gallery while shooting the event to everyone I shoot. The event photos are inexpensive, but I still sell about $1,000 a month in online event photos.

Like Holly and Christie, I also never post portrait sessions online - all sales are done in the studio via projection proofing (moving to a 60" flat screen soon - but same concept). Photography is a business and ALL businesses run on SALES. I would never trust that a client is viewing the photos on a color calibrated monitor, nor would I trust that when friends view the images with them that they are getting good feedback (it is SHOCKING what some people believe to be good photography and conversely, bad photography).

It all starts in the consultation. If you have NOT set them up for the proofing session before you ever trip the shutter by asking them how they wish to have the images displayed, you're also shooting yourself in the foot. If the client comes to the proofing session without a clear idea already of what they are likely to purchase, you'll see them confused and frustrated which leads to fewer sales and sometimes NO sale (when they say, "This is all so much to absorb, can I think about it and get back to you later?").

Conduct a true consultation in advance of the session, discuss the needs they have for the images and subsequent prints, then get the client in your studio (or home), do a formal presentation of the final images (there needs to be a SMALL number of proofed images - I proof 24 MAX) and control the sales process.

Controlling the proofing portion of the sales process is as important as anything else you do in the transaction with the client. Doing all the hard work by booking the client, shooting the session, culling and processing the images and then NOT controlling the sales process, you'll lose 80% to 90% of your sales.

[my3peas]

Originally Posted by Fireball

I'm using smugmug so I just pay the yearly fee and have unlimited space so there's no need to worry about running out of room. I'm a big newbie, maybe 1-2 shoots a month, so I don't really have a need to take them down sooner so that's why I was wondering what I would tell a client. As it stands I'm telling them their gallery stays up for 3 mos. and then comes down. I do like the idea of charging them for putting the gallery back up but again, I wouldn't know how to collect that money since I don't accept credit cards. That would mean meeting with them again and getting another check.

I'm a location photographer only and have not come to the point of meeting again afterwards and showing them their pics on my laptop. I'm still learning the salesman part of this business and find it a bit uncomfortable "pressuring" people into buying prints, etc. I used to do a shoot for $200 or less and give them all the edited photos on a CD and that was the end of it. I quit doing that this year, but am still learning all the rest of it.

I think the problem with leaving the galleries up longer is this: Why would they buy prints from you if they can go to the computer and see the images? I think you're doing yourself a disservice by not offering credit card processing. Maybe start with a paypal account to process the cards, if you think the fees are too expensive, build them into your product pricing.

You are not pressuring anyone to purchase from you. They came to you for a service that you provide. In order for you to stay in business and offer the same service to other people, you must take orders. Set your policies so that you aren't waiting 3 months for an order and can move on to provide better and more products. Food for thought: if they were going to JC Penney, they'd have to buy their prints then and there.

The thing is, our clients won't know what is expected of them unless we tell them. So by setting it straight upfront, they know what they're getting into.

Hope this helps!

[HotHolly]

Originally Posted by my3peas

Why would they buy prints from you if they can go to the computer and see the images?

This is the core reason why online proofing kills sales. It fulfills the emotional need to have the image and take it home. And then they buy much less from you. Some folks wont buy anything because that was enough for them.

Originally Posted by Fireball

I'm a location photographer only and have not come to the point of meeting again afterwards and showing them their pics on my laptop.

I think a lot of new photogs do this because they assume this is the way people start out. Just because something is there (online proofing), and someone else is doing it, does NOT mean that it works. As soon as any photog goes pro (which means you sell your work) you must add proofing to your business.

I'm still learning the salesman part of this business and find it a bit uncomfortable "pressuring" people into buying prints, etc. I used to do a shoot for $200 or less and give them all the edited photos on a CD and that was the end of it. I quit doing that this year, but am still learning all the rest of it.

Bad salesmen pressure people into buying crap they dont want. Good ones dont do that. They do something else entirely. There is so much info about this topic that I could write an entire book. (And some of you know that I did. Its in its soft launch phase while Im collecting feedback. That is about to end. If you want more info, look at my blog). Good salespeople dont pressure anyone to buy anything. Remember that. Its important!

You are making some very common errors that can be easily corrected. While I may stand alone (or with very few friends) with my thoughts about online proofing, we have one of the highest post-sessions sales stats in the region. So, Im not shooting my mouth off without having tried this stuff. We dumped online proofing several years ago and havent gone back. And it made a HUGE difference.

The next step is figuring out how and where you can proof. When I started proofing in person, I had paper proof sets and went to the clients home. They LOVED that. Now we do projected in studio, but not everyone can do that. And you dont have to. That's what makes proofing awesome. ;o)

[bondarnes]

This is probably the one area that separates true professional photographers from all the wannabes. Correct selling involves finding out what your clients needs are and trying to help them fulfill those needs within their budget. We have found that by simply showing the clients various ways their images can be used has more than doubled our sales. If you are not helping your clients fulfill their needs (selling), then you are not fulfilling your mission as a photographer.

Can you imagine a cardiologist posting your EKG online and expecting you to prescribe the proper treatment? Of course not. They will have you come back to their office and explain all of your options and suggest a proper course of treatment.

[reader0428]

I'm just barely getting started with paid sessions. But thanks to lots of helpful information I've read on here, here's what I'm doing:

1. Having a phone consultation with clients prior to their session (which includes asking them several questions about what they hope for in their finished portraits AND how they are planning to display them - sizes they are looking for, etc.) This is also when I tell them that we will schedule a viewing session in their home about 2 weeks after our session, and that I will take their order at that time.
2. Sending them a "preparing for your photo session" document
3. Have the shoot. I remind them at the end of the shoot that we will schedule a viewing session within two weeks and that I will take their order then.
4. I put up three watermarked images on Facebook to give them a "sneak peek" and get them excited about seeing the rest of the images.
5. Meet, show the images (on my laptop for now, hope to get a projector down the road) and take orders.

I've asked for feedback on this ordering process. The few paying clients I've had so far have said nice things about it. I think what keeps it from being a hard sell is knowing when to shut up. I show them the slide show, ask "what do you think?" and I shut up. They go through them all again, make notes, say things like "oh it's so hard to choose!", ask me questions about which ones I think will go well together in double frames, which will look the best enlarged, etc. I answer their questions and then shut up. I am not pushing anything on them (although I do have my samples of various print sizes and frames with me so they can see what I have to offer) - I present what I have, shut up, and let them make the decision. And I get the order before I leave their house. I'll have to keep you posted about how this goes long-term, but in the very early days, so far so good!

[HeatherLou]

Don't look at it as pressuring them. You are their helper, guiding them through the process of buying portraits! This is why proofing your session is so important. Don Barnes told me long ago, that if I bit the bullet and started projection sales, I would see an instant improvement. He was soooooo right!

I DO have all of my sessions online. However, that is only AFTER they make the initial purchase during the proofing session. I don't make a whole lot of sales online, but enough to pay for Smugmug every year.

If you are going to continue to have online ordering, shorten your time WAY down. I like Chrisite's idea of the 3 days. It creates a sense of urgency for your client, and keeps the excitement in the air.

[J Eddington]

First with Smugmug, you can take credit cards. You might need to upgrade your service with them. Just set a photo up with a reposting fee and once they pay it, you then repost the gallery.

You want people to make a decision. When you do the shoot make sure that they understand that the gallery will only be up for 3-14 days, after that it comes down and you make sure that you have your sales. IF not they may never make a decision. Some have waited up to a year. IF they purchase $$$ during that time, and they want it to remain up for say, grandparents then I would extend it an additional 7 days at no charge.

IF you are going to do sales online, then determine what they NEED in your pre-shoot consultation. Then presell that and then as they go online they can order more not less than what they have already purchased.