So, you want to use copyrighted music, huh?

[RKDauph]

Originally Posted by scottbuckel

Tom - my IP attorney disagrees with yours, she thinks that my specific example (a slide show that is not broadcast in any way) would be considered fair use, but if you posted it to Youtube or some other social network it would be clear violation of copyright. She also feels that the use of school portraits in the same slide show presentation to be fair use as well as long as it does not get posted to a social network site or published/broadcast by some other manner. I am also giving very specific limited use, while you are listing the possible penalties with no examples of the use of the downloaded music.

There is a lot of gray areas around what defines fair use.

IP attorneys vary a lot in their opinions and the aggressiveness of defense of their clients.

Scott

Scott,

If your client uploads the video/slideshow to FB or Youtube - who is in violation of the law? Honest question - not picking a fight.

Ray

[Howard Barlow]

Originally Posted by scottbuckel

... my IP attorney disagrees with yours

...IP attorneys vary a lot in their opinions and the aggressiveness of defense of their clients.

Scott

Does your IP attorney litigate cases in court, or only give advice? The reason I ask, one of the country's top IP litigators, Ed Greenberg, NY, offers his opinion on those attorneys who offer advice, and those who actually fight it out in court. It's one of those 'on paper the plan works, on the field, well, that's another story' type things.

Greenberg can be found here, along with past PPA pres, Jack Reznicki. They are on kelbytraining.com, as well.

[scottbuckel]

Originally Posted by RKDauph

Scott,

If your client uploads the video/slideshow to FB or Youtube - who is in violation of the law? Honest question - not picking a fight.

Ray

Most likely it would be an issue for both of us and this is why I did convince them to use RF music, as I figured they may do that and I did not want to have to deal with that possibility. That right I did not trust that my client to use the slide show as I described.

Yes she does ligate and mostly in the music area which is very complex. She dealt with a photo case for me that did not go to court, but got me a very nice check (not six figures though).

Scott

[Howard Barlow]

Originally Posted by scottbuckel

Yes she does ligate and mostly in the music area which is very complex. She dealt with a photo case for me that did not go to court, but got me a very nice check (not six figures though).

Scott

Good. After listening to Greenberg, I think the first question I would ask an IP atty is how many cases they've actually litigated, before I put both feet in the boat.

[scottbuckel]

Originally Posted by Howard Barlow

Good. After listening to Greenberg, I think the first question I would ask an IP atty is how many cases they've actually litigated, before I put both feet in the boat.

How I met her is a very long story, and she told me the same thing I heard from Greenberg at Photoshop World, hire the person that does ligate as they will have a better grounding in reality. She also told me that many artists get all starry eyed when a case starts, quoting the maximum penalties, and they need to get a sense of reality as well.

Earlier this morning I went to a website, that had music which is bad enough, and then I realized it was another person (tho not a photographer this time) that was violating a musician's copyright. Just kind of irritates me, particularly they had a message of how certain groups were taking their rights away from them. . .

Scott

[picman]

This story came from a seminar I went to a number of years ago so don't remember the details, but - large corporation, without clearance, used the Rocky theme in an in-house presentation shown only to employees. Copyright owner went after them for infringement and won. Better safe than sorry.

[tukaniray]

Originally Posted by Howard Barlow

There is no 'try'. That is their only lawful option. And, no, you are not protected because they 'demand' you violate federal law. You are the violator, not them. "But, your honor, they made me do it," doesn't fly.

I see.

No worries, I don't do much if any major Weddings ... I only pop up as a second shooter for some.

My main stuff as videographer comes through as Camera op or Technical director for multi-camera stuff. So, thankfully, I don't run into that decision often.

But I like this thread, definitely an eye opener for many who do use popular music in their edits. And for those who are guilty of using popular music here and there ......... like me for small personal projects.

-Ray-

[kenw]

on a related note: do you have a copyrighted (but not by you) avatar? Been seeing a few...

[Howard Barlow]

Originally Posted by kenw

on a related note: do you have a copyrighted (but not by you) avatar? Been seeing a few...

Yes, but my wife gave me permission.