Please don't judge me on this one...

[brit41]

This is the ever-dillema that I face.
People see my work, they like my work, they want me to photograph them. That is great and all but I struggle with many things when it comes to charging clients. I don't consider myself 'professional' but yet I have people who are willing to pay good money for me to photograph them. I don't understand it!

So, what I do is I photograph them and charge a flat fee for a CD that I give them. I know this is bad but I don't know how else to do it! I feel that it is only fair to charge at least something for my own personal time and processing time, but I feel like I am limited to what ' a real photographer' should charge because I don't consider myself professional yet. Does any of this make sense? Bottom line is....I am slowly trying to get to where I feel that I am good enough to fairly charge the clients that I work with, but currently, I charge the bare minimum to keep it fair for myself and for the clients. I feel like I am truly hurting the profession of photographers out there but I honestly don't know where to start with all of this. I read books, I try contacting people to get opinions and advice but it seems so overwhelming.

Has anyone ever experienced this starting out? I don't want to jeapordize my fellow photographers but I need help!

[JohnT]

The way I see it, there are two options:

1) Charge what your target market will bear. In other words, find out what pros in your area are charging for like services and adjust your pricing accordingly so you aren't necessarily hurting them.

2) Charge nothing at all, and refuse to accept any payment except maybe to cover the cost of the disk. Do not consider or advertise yourself being in business.

I know this sounds like a simple solution, but I believe in KISS whenever possible.

[CaptainTom]

It depend on what you want your clients to think of you.

charge nothing - they think you feel your work isn't good enough, and that's what they'll think of it as well.

charge a little - see above

charge a fair price - They will know you value your skills and they will value them as well.

[brit41]

thanks yall for the input- I appreciate it so much...

[ndsimm]

If you call yourself a pro, then charge what a pro charges....

[brad]

Originally Posted by brit41

So, what I do is I photograph them and charge a flat fee for a CD that I give them. I know this is bad but I don't know how else to do it!

Who said this is bad?

Its perfectly fine if it fits in your business model.

Now, you don't have a business model yet... so what you have to do is figure out what your costs are (equipment depreciation as well as materials used to deliver and location fees if you have them) and put a value on your time as well... and then charge that. This is true whether you are delivering a product in prints or delivering them on CD.

Remember, you are not selling them a CD or a piece of paper with their picture on it... you are selling a service. Your first step in feeling better about charging for your work is to realize you are providing a service. Do not worry about it "being good enough" to be professional.. if you wait until you feel that way, you may never get there. You *are* good enough if people want to pay you to make images for them.... they are paying you for a service that you can provide.. not because they think you are a professional.

[brit41]

Awwwwweee Thanks so much for that Brad- that makes me feel a little better. I actually have met you at one of your lighting workshops and you were very nice and helpful :)

So, I totally agree with you about feeling better about what I charge...and realizing the importance of the 'service' that I am selling- that is important.. Where else can I start with finding out how to run this type of biz? Would you suggest I read certain books, go back to school, learn Quickbooks, find a mentor?

I know that is a loaded question but I guess I am looking for a step by step plan and there probably isn't one. I am sure (after reading one of the threads on sales tax) I will need to get me a CPA and a lawyer one day as well.

How do most people who are 'self taught' get into this biz???? Trial and error? That wouldn't be fun :r

[brad]

Trial and error... and a bit of luck.

There are no "secrets" to the business.. it is a business, just like any other. The way to be successful is to work hard, know your craft, advertise, satisfy every customer to the best of your ability, rinse, repeat.

[darrenwilson]

I will chime in and agree with Brad...I don't see anything wrong with shooting for a fair price and giving them the digital files of the images you've captured and processed. I am in the process of taking my "hobby" to the next level and may or may not ever go "pro" but I know that I am providing a valuable service to my friends and their friends.

I hardly ever jump in on these discussions, because I have been doing just this for about a year and a half, and there are many people here who don't approve of doing business that way. The fact is, I have learned enough to provide a valuable service, and at the same time fund my hobby. "Giving away" images definitely fits in my business model and continues to work well for me. It may not work for you, but that's no reason to feel bad about it either way.

You are welcome to go to my website read about what is working for me and try what you like and ignore the other stuff. It works for me as I am getting better every time I go out for a shoot. It has funded two nice camera bodies and few "L" lenses and some other goodies.

Its a free country. Shoot...have fun...provide a good service...make some spending money...learn something new...repeat.

[brit41]

Thank you Darren!

:0)

[dartlrt]

Hi Brittany,

You may not feel like a professional, but as long as you are accepting money for your work you are in the pro ranks.

Don't sell your images on a CD, but instead sell a license to the client for the use of your images.

Here is a good website for you to checkout.
http://www.asmp.org/

[brit41]

Hey Darren...

Just checked out your website & I am very impressed! You definitely got talent along with a genuineness about your work. KISS ... i should remember that huh :)

Do you work the exact same with your wedding folks?

[darrenwilson]

Thanks, Brittany. I've only done one wedding, but have two more scheduled in June. Yes, I charged a flat $100/hr. and uploaded the processed images to their SmugMug gallery.

[brit41]

Last question ( and this may be a silly one) but can you tell me what a digital negative actually is? Is is the original/unprocessed image or the editing one? I have heard some people want the digital negative...I am not quite sure why they would want that if they could have the retouched/edited version.

[brad]

Originally Posted by dartlrt

Don't sell your images on a CD, but instead sell a license to the client for the use of your images.

Good distinction.

My license for images on CD says they have the right to reprint the images for personal use... but all copyright (including right to sell it as stock) remains with me.

As for which files.. only the files that have been retouched by me and approved by me make it out the door on CD. With only one exception, I have never (and will never) give print rights to any untouched image.

(The one exception was shooting a wedding for a friend from here on the forum.. knowing his work in post processing, I had no problem handing off the RAW files to him.)