How do you keep it all straight...

[m_mphotography]

Now that I'm going into business with my photography, I am wondering how others (YOU) manage to keep it all straight. I mean, with all the shoots...the RAW files, the JPGS (or TIFF), the cropped ones, and the ones with certain effects, the small versions with LOGOS or PROOF all over them and such....HOW DO YOU DO IT?? I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed now that I"ve done a few "practice shoots" for friends. My workflow normally is:
1. After I get home from a shoot, I will download my RAW files onto my external drive (I know...I know...I should also save in another place for backup--what do you use?? another external drive?? another folder?? or do you backup on CD?
2. I go through and delete all of the "out takes" to narrow down the number of shot to edit.
3. Then I create 3 folders on my drive, where my RAW files are. I create a folder for the .psd files, a folder for the jpg files and a folder for the ones that I will watermark and post for proofing (which I crop to 4x5)
4. I start to process the raw files using ACR ( I can't afford Lightroom quite yet) and just keep the corrected ones in the same folder with the .xmp file intact
5. I go through and do edits in CS3 (brighten up the eyes, and any actions that I may want to apply)
6. I save a .psd file in the PSD folder, then flatten the image, save one copy (UNCROPPED) in the JPG file.
7. I apply whatever effects I want, if I want a version in B&W, a version in Sepia...etc etc and save all of these into my JPG file

There here is where i haven't found a quick way to do this...Since I want to do my proofs in 4x5 size, I have to manually crop the pics for best composition in that size. So I have to individually go through and crop and save into my folder for the watermarked proofs. Once I've cropped all of these, I do a batch process and select to decrease the size on them to 900 pixels tall or 900 pixels wide, change the Color space to sRGB (because I work them all in AdobeRGB(1998), and add the watermark.

So, then this is all find and dandy until I get an order, and then I have to go into my originals (JPG folder) and recrop for the size that was ordered, send in my order to the lab and fill the clients order....and then what?? I'm stuck...what do I do with all the photos?? do I just keep ALL of it?? do I keep all of the RAW files, JPGS, and PSDs?? or do I delete the RAWs, and the PSDs?? what do you do??

I'd be interested in getting some good insight into YOUR processes...and why you do what you do....

thanks ahead of time....

[dlanter]

You already said you don't have Lightroom, but I would HIGHLY recommend it. It not only helps immensely with organization, but since I do most of my editing & conversions there, it cuts down the number of files you need of the same pic.

I normally have no more than 2 files of the same shot, the original RAW and the edited TIF if I needed to do anything to it in Photoshop. If I need to re-size, crop, etc. for printing I do it in Lightroom without saving another file. I export as jpgs to a special folder when uploading to the printer, but then delete the jpg when done with it. I use the rating systems a lot to help find specific files. There is a 1 to 5 star rating and 6 color ratings, that's a lot of combinations.

As far as my file system, I rename files with the shot date - keyword (like client name) - sequence number. For example - 20081005Dan001, I have my folders seperated first by year, type of shot (portrait, wedding, etc.) and client name.

BTW, I am not a pro and probably don't have the volume of shots that you have. I am just a hobbiest who gets an occasional paying shoot, but I shoot a LOT for myself.

[The Philos]

I usually crop to 8x10 and recrop if necessary for the print, but most of my prints have enough room from the subject that 8x10 to 11x14 won't matter when it comes to the slight disconnect in what's visible.

[hhscr]

Lightroom 2 is designed as a photo data base and will make your filing easier.

[barP]

anyone who's going to shoot any kind of volume for any kind of money is at a huge disadvantage without lightroom.

that said, my filing system is to put everything and keep everything from a particular shoot in a project folder, ie. "smith wedding" which is accessible in my "2008 weddings" catalog in lightroom. this won't make much sense, though, unless you have lightroom.

buy it.

wp.

[CobyPhoto]

Originally Posted by barP

anyone who's going to shoot any kind of volume for any kind of money is at a huge disadvantage without lightroom.

Really? I shoot close to a TeraByte a Year now (that I keep) and I don't use Lightroom to handle my data management and I can find any client, any image with minimal effort.

The software isn't the key, it is the structure and organization of the file storage system and how well you adhere to that structure. My issue with Lightroom is the fact it DOES catalog everything and gets slow with the amount of work I do. Then I have to go back into Lightroom and remove the catalog (extra work) to keep my server from slowing down Lightroom.

Think out your file structure prior to implementing it and make sure you adhere to it. There is nothing more frustrating than changing in mid-stream and not being able to find something because you changed your system.

CJ

[Ahh!]

Originally Posted by CobyPhoto

Really? I shoot close to a TeraByte a Year now (that I keep)...and I can find any client...The software isn't the key...Think out your file structure prior to implementing it and make sure you adhere to it.

What might you suggest to answer the OP?

[Jenny Z]

It's all in file structure...

I have a few folders for various things. Bridals, Engagements, Weddings, Portraits, Miscellaneous.

Inside those folders, I make folders that include the date and name of the event. So something like "2008_04_12 - Francie and Wesley Smith" inside the Wedding folder.

Inside that folder I put the RAW files, then as I process, I make new folders inside that folder. Usually "Prints" (hi-res, Adobe rGB), "Website" (smaller, sRGB, not watermarked for my website), "Blog" (smaller, sRGB, watermarked), and "TIFFs" (for files I do extensive work on that are saved as TIFFs, in case I want to go back later and change something)

The resizing and sRGB profile change can be done by batch processing in CS3.

Sounds like alot, but it doesn't take any time, and is searchable by date or name.

[CobyPhoto]

Originally Posted by Ahh!

What might you suggest to answer the OP?

My entire file structure is based on a concecutive numbering system that corresponds to my invoicing system. I name each file within a job with the invoice number: 1001_Example_001 and file them in a folder under the current year in a folder called 1001_Example.

Versions of the individuals are filed in the main folder. Once completed, I only keep the raw files and print files. All other are discarded. For weddings I do keep my proof file (CD Flip ALbum Pro).

If a client comes in looking for re-prints, I can search my accounting data base by name, job description or date and find the invoice number and then I know exactly what drive, folder name and file to go find.

It would take way too much time to detail all the system here. I am very specific in how I name and file images and adhere to that on all my data.

CJ

[m_mphotography]

I don't have the $$ for Lightroom right now, so unless you want to gift it to me, then I have to do with what I have.

So, I'm not way off base then with what I have, I was just feeling overwhelmed with all the files that I keep, but I guess it's not too out of the ordinary. I haven't done TONS of shooting quite yet, but I wanted to be ready for when I do....cuz like Coby said I wouldn't want to change midstream due to lack of planning. Up until this point the way I do it, is to keep all work on a separate drive. I have a main folder that so far, I just name "Client Last name and Type of shoot" (maybe I need to rethink this), then inside there I have all my RAW files, and several other folders (which I previoulsy mentioned) I have gone back and deleted all the RAW files that are not worthy of keeping, but I keep all the others....I'll have to brainstorm to come up with something that works and is consistent.

[gaea106]

Marleny,

Now that Lightroom 2 is out you might start looking for old 1.1 versions out on the resale market for cheap.

Another thing, I got Lightroom 1.1 and Photoshop CS3 in a bundle for $399 and Microsoft Office 2007 professional edition for $199. I am a student, and you get huge discounts on software and even some photo equipment. If you know any students, even high school or community college you might strike up a deal with them or take a few "refresher" classes and take advantage of some of the discounts while you have a college id.

My dad (professional photographer) burns everything to CD or DVD when the job is completed and paid for and files it in his file cabinet with the invoices. Keep in mind though he doesn't really do his own Photoshop work, he sends things off to a digital lab. While the job is in progress he files things by date and name on the computer to match his appointment book.

[barP]

Originally Posted by CobyPhoto

Really?

yes, but not just because of the file management. if that's all it did, then it would hardly be worth the money.

by the way...let's say you wanted to find all shots you took in italy last june at f2.8 with your mark 3 (assuming all that happened!).

how would you do that?

wp.

[CobyPhoto]

Originally Posted by barP

yes, but not just because of the file management. if that's all it did, then it would hardly be worth the money.

by the way...let's say you wanted to find all shots you took in italy last june at f2.8 with your mark 3 (assuming all that happened!).

how would you do that?

wp.

The same way you would. You would have to spend time inputing keywords that would help you find 'Italy', then choose the rest of the metadata. Lightroom isn't going to add that for you without some effort on your part. (Oh and by the way, I can do that in Bridge as well.)

You have to remember, I am giving an answer based on doing this as a business. Everything I do is based on the needs of a client. I would have no need to find anything other than cient images in my business and this was a question based on that premise.

Were you a landscape photographer, then the ability to choose a certain geographic area of the world might prove useful. But again, I would affect this ability the same way you do, input keywords into Lightroom or Bridge that allow me to search.

I currently tag my images with the Numberic_Filename in order to assure that I can use these features in addition to my file system.

The fact remains, LIghtroom isn't the 'savior' of managing digital assets you make it seem. Bridge has a very good (similar) system that you can use as well. And there are others, that I just have no use for as well, but I am sure would work just as well as Lightroom.

CJ

[barP]

fair points, but the only part of that metadata you would have to input would be "italy", and you would only spend 5 seconds on that because you'd do it on import and lightroom would automatically attach that key word to all images.

again, if all you need are file management features, then bridge, photo mechanic, and others will serve, but the ability to do volume adjustments is where the real power of lightroom is. in that respect, there's no denying it's competitive advantage.

wp.

[Jenny Z]

I'm confused... I can add Metadata to Bridge too, and with only a click or two. And I can "batch process" photos easily using presets. That's why I use it.

I don't think LR is a "competitive advantage"...