Re-visiting Earlier Thread.

[cvalene]

I've made a thread a bit back about this- But now I have more information but still need help with what I will probably need for this shoot! I've never done a professional shoot of a family this large... Caution: This is a long anxiety-filled post.

Specs are:
13 people - 3 groupings

1) The mom and dad with an 18 yr old. (choosing to wear polos- grey)

2) The daughter and her husband with 2 other children: 1 and 5 yrs (polos- white)

3) The second daughter and her husband with 4 other children: 7mo, 3yrs, 5yrs, and 8yrs. (polos- dark blue)

They're all choosing to wear jeans.

Location: Grapevine by Bear Creek Park; Outdoors next to a pond, surrounded by short grass.

Time of Day: I've been able to push to 5:30p (it's difficult to arrange because of the children's temperaments around this time of day) so hopefully the lighting will be fair by then in that area.

The shots that the mother wants is a full family shot, grandchildren, siblings(3), and then each family grouping.


--- So my questions:

>> Lighting??
I have no idea how to light this. I've only began to use lighting on an individual. I have a large reflector (I believe it's a 40in.), and a Canon 430EX II speedlite (I doubt that would be strong enough to help?) with no modifiers for that. That's it. I am able to rent from Arlington Camera for a fairly good price.

Here's the link to the rental page: Arlington Camera - Digital Cameras, Video, Photographic Equipment

>>Arrangements?
I figure the children will be sitting or standing at the front. I've looked up family photos to give myself ideas but it's so hard to get the right setup with such a unordinary amount of children to adult ratio. Again, I've never even done a family shoot professionally. Especially this large besides by own family. I figure the "Mom and Dad" in the center of the arrangement, and each grouping on each side. The 18 yr old can be maneuvered in there beside the parents, he's almost 6 ft so I feel that would be the right place for him.

This family is close friends of mine fyi.

>>Lens?
I'm going to rent, I really don't want to have to take this photo with my 18-55mm, I think that would just not be the best that it could be in comparison to a "better" lens.. whatever lens that would be. Any suggestions?

Sorry that I'm such a worrywart, and I'm only 19 so I'm really freaking out on this one. The shoot is June 2nd 2011, the family is together because the 18yr old is graduating the next day.

If any of you could pleeasepleaaaaase help me out with some of this. (I know this is asking for a lot.)

Thank you so much,
Cherese

p.s. I figured this would go under "equipment talk" because I'm in most need about what lighting and lenses. Sorry if I posted in the wrong place. I'm fairly new at this forum.

[ChrisTX]

Personally, I would use the 18-55 and just shoot candids of them interacting. Those are the best pictures; at least to me. Would you rather people look at the pictures and say, "Oh, that was the day we all went to Bear Creek Park when _______ graduated", or, would you rather them look at the pictures and say, "That was the day we couldn't get the kids to smile, and it was hot and we just wanted out of there"?

That's just me though.

[cvalene]

No, believe me.. I'm completely with you... but the mother is really traditional. I'm planning on getting candids as well because those are my favorite but I know she's going to want a "formal" set up for the groups. So I want to get the details down for those because I know those are the prints she's going to be buying for sure. She specifically told me what she wanted when it came to what photo groupings(the siblings, grandbabies, etc.). She's a dominator(a big boss personality), I just listened and jotted down what she wanted... as a should. Ah, I'm excited for this shoot, but will happy when the prints are in her hands. Thank you for the input. :)

[49884]

Just a couple of pointers, I would suggest doing a practice shoot. Find a place that you can shoot at the same time of day that you plan on doing the shoot (5:30- and after) Try your lens to see if it will give you the results you expect. The range of your lens is ideal for that group size. Do you have a way to use off camera flash? A flash on a stand would give you good fill lighting. If it were me doing the shoot I would use my 24-70 and 2 remote flashes on stands to give me enough flash power without too much light fall-off. Shoot through umbrellas would work fine. Use the evening sun as a back light 45-90 degrees behind your subjects. Good luck on your shoot.

[DigMe]

Originally Posted by 49884

Just a couple of pointers, I would suggest doing a practice shoot. Find a place that you can shoot at the same time of day that you plan on doing the shoot (5:30- and after) Try your lens to see if it will give you the results you expect. The range of your lens is ideal for that group size. Do you have a way to use off camera flash? A flash on a stand would give you good fill lighting. If it were me doing the shoot I would use my 24-70 and 2 remote flashes on stands to give me enough flash power without too much light fall-off. Shoot through umbrellas would work fine. Use the evening sun as a back light 45-90 degrees behind your subjects. Good luck on your shoot.

I agree with all of the above regarding the lighting. Rent two 580EX IIs from your rental place. I would use silver-backed umbrellas in bounce instead of shoot-through for a larger group. If they don't rent umbrellas and stands you can get those relatively cheaply from amazon.com or mpex.com. One flash bounced off umbrella on each side and maybe even the flash you already own mounted on your camera for a bit of fill-flash in the middle. You should bring a short ladder to get up on as well for a very slight downward angle. When Lifetouch shoots their group pic of the elementary teachers at a school they actually use one single bounce umbrella in-line with and above the photographer for a shot of ~30-40 teachers. The further you can get away from your group the more pleasing the pic will be (within limits of course). The wider your focal length the closer you are and therefore the less pleasing the perspective.

brad

[DougC]

Talk them out of wearing white clothing.

[DigMe]

Originally Posted by DougC

Talk them out of wearing white clothing.

True that!!

brad

[cvalene]

Just a couple of pointers, I would suggest doing a practice shoot. Find a place that you can shoot at the same time of day that you plan on doing the shoot (5:30- and after) Try your lens to see if it will give you the results you expect.

I will definitely do that, thank you!

Do you have a way to use off camera flash? A flash on a stand would give you good fill lighting. If it were me doing the shoot I would use my 24-70 and 2 remote flashes on stands to give me enough flash power without too much light fall-off. Shoot through umbrellas would work fine.

Well, the lighting situation is iffy to me.
I looked at renting this "DELUXE PACKAGE SYSTEM Studio quality lighting for location portraits and wedding groups. It weighs 26 lbs. and measures 21 1/2" x 9" x 12". Includes: one M500XL power pack with power cable and sync cord, three 1015 convection cooled flash heads with 15' cables, two 40" reflective white/removable black back umbrellas, three 7' retractable light stands, a grid spot holder and one 40° grid."

I mean... that would be very easy for me since it has it all together and it's only $40 for 24hrs at Arlington Camera. Wouldn't this be ideal as well?

Thank you for all the helpful tips, Mario.

Rent two 530EX IIs from your rental place. I would use silver-backed umbrellas in bounce instead of shoot-through for a larger group. If they don't rent umbrellas and stands you can get those relatively cheaply from amazon.com or mpix.com.

So I'm guessing the above flash heads wouldn't work? How do I sync those off camera?
And then I'd have to get lighting stands(rented for $5 ea. I think) and the umbrellas. (I'd have to purchase.) Not too bad I suppose. I have one 430EX II already.

You should bring a short ladder to get up on as well for a very slight downward angle.

Most likely going to have a fairly tall ladder, I'm only 5ft. :)

When Lifetouch shoots their group pic of the elementary teachers at a school they actually use one single bounce umbrella in-line with and above the photographer for a shot of ~30-40 teachers. The further you can get away from your group the more pleasing the pic will be (within limits of course).

very very helpful, thank you.

Thanks a lot, Brad.

Talk them out of wearing white clothing.

Ah.. hopefully they didn't already buy the Polos...
Just wondering, why do you say this? Will it draw too much attention?

Thank you

[DougC]

Digital photography and prints are the greatest way to prove that white is the absence of all color. There is literally nothing there so you are looking at bare, white paper when you make a print.

[cvalene]

Digital photography and prints are the greatest way to prove that white is the absence of all color. There is literally nothing there so you are looking at bare, white paper when you make a print.

Ah, and I dislike the matchy thing all together... I'll let her know today. Thank you for that advice. Any colors I could suggest?

[DougC]

Anything other than white!!

[cvalene]

Anything other than white!!

Haha thank you Doug.

[Angelo]

Cherese, I'm excited for you.
Let us see the results.

[David Whatley]

The problem with the rental lights will be how to power them. The power pack has to be "plugged" in to a power source. If there is power avaliable, then that is the way I would go. You need to scout the location. Lack of Light may not be the issue, but to much light. Go look at the locateion and report back. Is shade avaliable, what about a way to pose them? What if it rains? Is there power to plug into avaliable?

[DigMe]

Also, do you know how to use and adjust these lights?

Whether you have those lights or some others you'll need a way to trigger them as well (like a pocket wizard setup etc..). If you get two 580EX IIs you can use one on your camera in commander mode to trigger everything and then the other 580 + your 430ex as the side lights. i'm a Nikon shooter but I assume that the 430ex can be a slave to the 580ex II.

brad