Professional portraits with cheap lights:

[Mr.Shneeblie]

Originally Posted by Coogie

Anything is possible and if someone had a gun to my head and wanted portraits I could do what this guy is doing and probably get decent results, but to call it "professional" is laughable. Let's say you're a law office with 20 employees who wants to take professional pictures for newsletters, website, etc. Photographer A and his assistant show up with their monoblocks, lightboxes, pocket wizard, backdrops, and sets up and Photographer B shows up with shower curtains, home depot clip on lights and AC insulation. If you know nothing about photography, who would you hire?

Before you give me the "it's the results that matter, not the procedure", I'm betting that a good photographer can take much better pictures with professional lighting gear where he can control the light levels can take better pictures than doing it McGroober style. I'd really like to see the actual large version of the photos too.

I agree with you for the most part. I don't think he's saying - sell your nice equipment and buy shower curtains - he's saying 'if you have nothing - don't feel you have to wait to own the best before you shoot your first portrait'. I started photography with an old Pentax Spotmatic - fully manual camera - I'm glad I did - it was cheap and taught me a lot. I also started in the darkroom before digital - I could not afford digital at the time, so I started where I could. Those just learning don't have to spend much. If you go this route - once you can afford fancy equipment - you'll already have the knowledge to use it.... my 2 cents....

John

[JohnT]

Originally Posted by Mr.Shneeblie

I agree with you for the most part. I don't think he's saying - sell your nice equipment and buy shower curtains - he's saying 'if you have nothing - don't feel you have to wait to own the best before you shoot your first portrait'. I started photography with an old Pentax Spotmatic - fully manual camera - I'm glad I did - it was cheap and taught me a lot. I also started in the darkroom before digital - I could not afford digital at the time, so I started where I could. Those just learning don't have to spend much. If you go this route - once you can afford fancy equipment - you'll already have the knowledge to use it.... my 2 cents....

John

Exactly. All have to start somewhere, and you don't have to spend a ton of money to do it.

[bondarnes]

Originally Posted by Coogie

Anything is possible and if someone had a gun to my head and wanted portraits I could do what this guy is doing and probably get decent results, but to call it "professional" is laughable.........

I'm not laughing. In my classes, I teach the "Make what you can afford work for you until you can afford something better method.", but that is not what I use in my business. I think it is great if you can afford to start your business with $30K of equipment, but that is the exception and not the norm. Just exactly what equipment did you start with?

[Tom]

Originally Posted by bondarnes

I'm not laughing. In my classes, I teach the "Make what you can afford work for you until you can afford something better method.", but that is not what I use in my business. I think it is great if you can afford to start your business with $30K of equipment, but that is the exception and not the norm. Just exactly what equipment did you start with?

First head shots I ever did was with two lamps with the shades removed, a bedsheet from target and duct tape.

[toverman]

Using what you have is important, but his background stands are still fancy!

[Mr.Shneeblie]

Originally Posted by toverman

Using what you have is important, but his background stands are still fancy!

I noticed that also - I guess you can make some out of 2x4's.....

[Ahh!]

Originally Posted by Coogie

I'd really like to see the actual large version of the photos too.

Well, its not Ralph's example, but here's an example. I while back I played crash test dummy for Don in preparing a shot for one of his clients with epilepsy. This is SOC. The setup was not dissimilar to what Ralph shows.

Don, I dunno if you did a pullback on this set up...

[revjvegas]

Originally Posted by Mr.Shneeblie

I noticed that also - I guess you can make some out of 2x4's.....

...or PVC pipe.

[bondarnes]

Originally Posted by Ahh!

Well, its not Ralph's example, but here's an example. I while back I played crash test dummy for Don in preparing a shot for one of his clients with epilepsy. This is SOC. The setup was not dissimilar to what Ralph shows.

Don, I dunno if you did a pullback on this set up...

Looks like I need to work on the white balance there. If I did a pullback I no longer have it.

[Coogie]

Well again I'm not saying it can't be done or you can't learn with using what you have, but when someone labels something as "professional", to me that includes their tools. It's not just with photography, it can be anything. Technically a dentist can get a lot done with just a pair of pliers, but to go pro, he probably needs to invest in a few extra tools.

[Ahh!]

Originally Posted by bondarnes

Looks like I need to work on the white balance there. If I did a pullback I no longer have it.

LOL, Don! That was just off the NEF. I think you were using a click white in PP on that session.

Originally Posted by Coogie

...but when someone labels something as "professional", to me that includes their tools. It's not just with photography, it can be anything. Technically a dentist can get a lot done with just a pair of pliers, but to go pro, he probably needs to invest in...

I am pleased to pleasantly agree to disagree, and I will try to be persuasive without being objectionable as I believe you mean well.

Sure, when my orthopedic surgeon removed the pin in my hand in his exam room with a portable drill from Home Depot, I was shocked. He pulled it out of a drawer stuffed with other junk, just like my kitchen, too! But the thing is, I can use my 5th metacarpal great, thanks to him.

Sure, I'm going to look more professional if I can show off my Photogenics, AB's, Henseys, Hammelflons; whatever. But if I can deliver the image regardless of the circumstances why shouldn't I try and earn a living from it? The tools just make it easier to earn enough to make a living at it and achieve consistent results (the thing) productively.

Let me leave this on a parallel note. We support a program that goes into some pretty dismal places with less than state of the art tools to do some pretty awesome work (since you mention dentists). You, too can do great things with the right training, in spite of the tools and circumstances. I invite you to take a few minutes and see their video. Using less than ideal conditions, these folks create masterpieces.

[duronboy]

It's not only the results that matter, but it's also the personality of the photographer that can ultimately affect future success. Ralph would totally agree that the prestige of the equipment plays a role. In fact, in his class he mentions that some of the examples are taken with a Canon 20D, a somewhat dated model that's several generations old. He makes it clear that they upgrade not only because of improved features, but because clients notice things like that, and image means a lot. However, at one time, the 20D was a widely used professional camera, and if that's what you have, it's perfectly ok. What you don't see in this video is Ralph's personality around clients. No matter who walks into the studio, a family of 4, elderly woman, young boy, whoever, he's instantly making them feel comfortable, chatting with them, and most importantly, getting the poses that count. Those are things you can practice with a point and shoot and a lamp.

And if you're shooting photos for a 20-man law office, they already know who they're going to hire. If they bring a guy in with bed sheets and a work lamp, they did it because he's going to rock.

[Laura1301]

Another quick tip for hanging backdrops. I am in the process of making a home studio and I am using velcro on the wall and velcro on the backdrop. Dirt cheap and really easy to set up and take down. All the credit for this idea goes to my dad. ;)

[ChristopherCoy]

Originally Posted by revjvegas

You should know where LaRose is then huh?
Talk 'bout your heavy accents.
Wife laughs at me every time we visit there cause I'll just slip back into it.

Do you mean Butte LaRose? On the levee? LOL

[ChristopherCoy]

Originally Posted by bondarnes

I think it is great if you can afford to start your business with $30K of equipment, but that is the exception and not the norm. Just exactly what equipment did you start with?

Aint that the flippin truth. After nearly a year I own three things: my D90 body, my grip, and an AB800. I still have yet to buy my own lens, and I use my SIL's lenses when we shoot a job.

I have plans to buy my first 70-200 2.8 lens in a few weeks, but thats only because I; A.)sold a gun, B.)have a birthday next week, and C.) will get an income tax return soon. Anything I own has been bought with 'hobby money' that I've made from selling various things (chickens, art supplies, other art equipment etc), and not a penny of it has come from my household income earned at my 'joe job.' Equipment expenses, travel expenses (After Dark, IUSA), software costs, and anything else has been paid for by small photography jobs that I've been able to book, or 2nd shooting weddings for my SIL. And while I'm at it, the only reason I got to attend After Dark, and IUSA was because I won a free pass to After Dark, and I went on a buddy pass to IUSA, otherwise there wouldn't have been any money for that at all.

When I say that I'm building a 'business' from scratch and using grass roots efforts to do it, I can honestly say that I truly mean it. Perhaps things haven't exactly skyrocketed because I DONT have the proper equipment yet, but I use what I have, book what I can, reinvest what I 'make', and slowly but surely it will get there.

I can tell you one thing that I have certainly learned, and that is how to budget money and balance a checkbook. Which is something that I NEVER knew how to do before... I still dont pay our household bills at all, that chore is left to my partner.