All you Wannabe photographers: Listen up

[venchka]

Like they say in the "Law & Order" promos, ripped from the headlines.

The following quote is from a PM that I wrote moments ago. Put 2 & 2 together and you'll figure out what I was talking about.

What we should all say:

No self-respecting photographer in their right mind would hand over all of their photos with no editing and no watermark.

I know it's tough when you're just starting out. Somewhere along the line you have to have respect for yourself and your work. I know. Times change. However, good photographers don't give away their originals. Or they didn't. I don't think times have changed that much.

Practice! Have fun!

Cheers!

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by venchka

I know it's tough when you're just starting out. Somewhere along the line you have to have respect for yourself and your work. I know. Times change. However, good photographers don't give away their originals. Or they didn't. I don't think times have changed that much.

Practice! Have fun!

Cheers!

[ChristopherCoy]

If folks wanna give away their originals, whats the big deal?

[bondarnes]

Originally Posted by ChristopherCoy

If folks wanna give away their originals, whats the big deal?

If you don't know the answer to that then please don't ever call yourself a professional photographer. It quite simply is not the professional thing to do.

[brad]

Lets be clear here that we are talking about portrait and perhaps wedding photographers here.... As for not handing them over with no editing and no watermark - photojournalists and commercial photographers do this all the time.


Plus also "give" is a broad term, interpreted by some using its literal meaning... and for others it means selling those originals at any price.


I *sell* digital files. I never *give* them.

[ChristopherCoy]

Originally Posted by bondarnes

If you don't know the answer to that then please don't ever call yourself a professional photographer. It quite simply is not the professional thing to do.

I didn't catch the 'without editing or watermarks' part. I read it too fast I guess....

Withdrawn...

[kayumangi]

No disrespect intended Don but why is it not professional?

If my time for shooting has already been well compensated and my raw images are satisfactory to the client, why can't I give them away?

[venchka]

OK, digital may bend the practices somewhat. Yes, you were supposed to to put 2+2 together and find a related thread here in Open Talk.

In this day and age, clients want everything and they want it now. That practice may work for some of you. Sooner or later it may bite you on the A$$. In the long run, retaining control of your photographs may be in your best interest.

[tammra]

Wayne...since you were referring to my post, I thought that I should at least have the opportunity to reply.

I never asked for anyone to do two photo shoots for FREE. I never stated that someone could not keep the originals. I did state that I wanted to receive the pictures that day unedited and asked that they be copied onto my laptop.

Now...I do understand that I wanted my pictures the same day and unedited, which seems unacceptable to you. BUT has it crossed your mind that I had a reason behind it?

I have received my wedding originals without them being edited, also many companies now will offer you your CD of your session for a price. I have spent 200-300 plus dollars for my Family Picture Cd's given to me the SAME DAY! that do not have watermarks or anything like that on them. Studio 1 to 1 and Sears to name 2 of them.

I did not need anyone to edit the pictures as my husband and I are more then capable of doing the editing ourselves. If we want a background changes why the heck can't we do it? And for the record, my grandmother is on hospice as we speak! I am sorry to say...that each and every picture was going to be edited and personalized for her! I should not have to explain things to you but there are some times that people have more important needs and much more urgent mattersthen you having your name on the photos! The moment and the pictures are not about your work but in this case...about giving memories to someone else that does not have much time.

Do you remotely think that I can get photos printed, edited with any captions that I want without having the pictures on my computer? And I am really sorry, but with your attitude, I sure as heck would not want to sit with you to get everything said in each and every photo!

Oh and the reason that I asked what camera someone was shooting was for the sole fact, I wanted to know if they could use my Nikon D300. I guess the thing is this...in short terms...I was simply asking someone for their time to shoot the pictures.

Next time that you have an issue with what someone posts, take it up with them!

Some people want their watermark on the pictures, some people do not. Every photographer is different. But to get UGLY about how each photographer handles their business is being judgemental.

[ronocnikral]

it certainly come back to haunt you. all money aside, i don't spend my time and hard work for someone else to edit photos how they would like. it's our name and dayna has been working since 2000 to build it. you know how many weddings we don't get b/c couples want to use our images for their save the dates? we put together prices for what they want, but they find someone else who will let them do it. i can't let hundreds of images go out without knowing what was done or what they look like.

if you want to edit your own images and print them yourself, buy or rent your own camera. i would rather spend my time shooting statues at glennwood with the bronica than doing a shoot for some demanding person. if anyone wants to test this, i suggest you do some photos for a friend and see how poorly you get treated.

i expect this crap on craigslist, but isn't there some rule against people doing this? i know models can't...

ronocnikral added 2 Minutes and 19 Seconds later...Double Post Merged Below

Originally Posted by tammra

Wayne...since you were referring to my post, I thought that I should at least have the opportunity to reply.

I never asked for anyone to do two photo shoots for FREE. I never stated that someone could not keep the originals. I did state that I wanted to receive the pictures that day unedited and asked that they be copied onto my laptop.

Now...I do understand that I wanted my pictures the same day and unedited, which seems unacceptable to you. BUT has it crossed your mind that I had a reason behind it?

I have received my wedding originals without them being edited, also many companies now will offer you your CD of your session for a price. I have spent 200-300 plus dollars for my Family Picture Cd's given to me the SAME DAY! that do not have watermarks or anything like that on them. Studio 1 to 1 and Sears to name 2 of them.

I did not need anyone to edit the pictures as my husband and I are more then capable of doing the editing ourselves. If we want a background changes why the heck can't we do it? And for the record, my grandmother is on hospice as we speak! I am sorry to say...that each and every picture was going to be edited and personalized for her! I should not have to explain things to you but there are some times that people have more important needs and much more urgent mattersthen you having your name on the photos! The moment and the pictures are not about your work but in this case...about giving memories to someone else that does not have much time.

Do you remotely think that I can get photos printed, edited with any captions that I want without having the pictures on my computer? And I am really sorry, but with your attitude, I sure as heck would not want to sit with you to get everything said in each and every photo!

Oh and the reason that I asked what camera someone was shooting was for the sole fact, I wanted to know if they could use my Nikon D300. I guess the thing is this...in short terms...I was simply asking someone for their time to shoot the pictures.

Next time that you have an issue with what someone posts, take it up with them!

Some people want their watermark on the pictures, some people do not. Every photographer is different. But to get UGLY about how each photographer handles their business is being judgemental.

maybe you should go to sears then...

[tammra]

Again it goes back to each and every photographer is different. Each one has their own rules of how they run their business. I don't have a problem that people want their name on it..everyone has their own preferences and needs at a given time. But a client or perspective client should not be put down because you or your business practices don't work for them.

And I did shoot a friends wedding...I was not treated like a piece of crap! I am no pro, nor is it my desire to be one! Perhaps you don't have respectable friends and that is your problem.

I did not get defensive until I came under fire by some of you people.

I don't need to go to sears as I found a local photographer that has agreed to work with me. And I greatly appreciate it.

So...lets everyone get over the issue.

[venchka]

Whatever works for everyone involved works for me.

The Client From Hell changed my direction a long time ago.

What a long strange trip it's been.

[tammra]

Wayne...I am sorry to hear about your client from hell...please understand not everyone is like that and the fact is...I am one of the most laid back people there is...until I came under fire.

As I said, I respect your decisions for your business. I would guess if I did photography for a living, I could understand your point. But I would also step back at times and see that each person has their own needs.

Again, I understand that you as a person and for your business has put everything in place so that things work for you. I just never expected to come under fire for simply looking for someone to do what I thought was a simple thing.

Again...it is as if I have come under fire as if I am a photographer...I am not one. I came across this website a few days ago to be honest with you for the sheer fact...I was trying to find a place to shoot my kids pictures. I was hiring someone so that I could be in the pictures with them.

I have never sold any of my work! Again, I apologize for the drama this has caused. If I would have known it was going to get so out of control I would never have posted.

[janikphoto]

This thread must be based on wedding or portrait shooters. In the corporate/commercial world, occasionally a client will want a full buy-out. I had it happen once or twice and they paid a ton extra for it. Fine, so I don't own the originals or the rights anymore, but several grand extra in my pocket for pics that would've been hard to sell on the secondary/stock market... I win!!!

With that said, I usually fight to keep my rights, or demand fair compensation if the client won't have it any other way.

[venchka]

Jason, you RULE!