Bad Day for Freelance WorkThis is a discussion on Bad Day for Freelance Work within the Open Talk forums, part of the General Information category; I decided yesterday to touch base with a couple of businesses in which I had done some freelance shooting. I ...
(#1)
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Posts: 1,506 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Huntsville, Texas Real First Name: David Camera: Nikon D700 Can Others Edit My Photos: Yes iTrader Rating: 0 LIKES Received: 84 LIKES Given: 53 | Bad Day for Freelance Work -
01-12-2011, 01:00 PM
I decided yesterday to touch base with a couple of businesses in which I had done some freelance shooting. I had sent in a couple of invoices for work done through November and I had not yet received payment.
Well I found out that the local sports magazine closed its doors on December 31st. The owner/publisher didn't hint at such when I spoke with him in the first first part of December. I am going to try to contact him one more time but doubt if he will talk with me. I found out he didn't even notify the editor directly but sent word through the man's son.
My other invoice job for November is with our local paper. When I sent in an e-mail inquirying about my pay to the person how had hired me, I received a response that he was no longer employed and that my e-mail was forwarded to the new sports editor. I'm thinking I need to make a personal appearance to introduce myself along with another copy of my invoice and the e-mail for the assistant managing editor stating what I would be paid.
And all of this is after contacting Printroom about not paying me the $555 they owe me. It's been a bad week and it's only Wednesday.  What a pain that people don't take care of their responsiblilities but at the time expect your work to be tack sharp and delivered pronto.
Now to decided if I want to pursue any more freelance jobs. | | | | | Sponsored Links | Premium Members do not see Google advertisements. SIGN UP today and help support our community.
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Posts: 3,065 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: West Houston, Texas Real First Name: Rob Camera: Canon 5D MarkII Can Others Edit My Photos: No iTrader Rating: 8 LIKES Received: 196 LIKES Given: 161 |
01-12-2011, 01:09 PM
Something good will come out of it.
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With no risk, comes no reward...
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(#3)
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Posts: 2,989 Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas Real First Name: Lisa Camera: Canon 5D Can Others Edit My Photos: Yes iTrader Rating: 4 LIKES Received: 0 LIKES Given: 0 |
01-12-2011, 01:18 PM
So sorry -that is really tough. Do you have any idea what type of entity the magazine was - a corporation, partnership or owned by an individual? You may be chasing pennies on the dollar, depending on other debts. I guess the first thing you need to know is the legal status and whether it is in bankruptcy. As for the paper, I would contact the new sports editor and asst and/or actual managing editor as well to, in a very nice way, follow up on this. Sounds like you may need to find a good local attorney who specializes in handling business disputes. I don't know anyone in Baytown, but I do know some Houston lawyers. | | | |
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Posts: 1,506 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Huntsville, Texas Real First Name: David Camera: Nikon D700 Can Others Edit My Photos: Yes iTrader Rating: 0 LIKES Received: 84 LIKES Given: 53 |
01-12-2011, 02:43 PM
Rob - Thanks and you are correct. I have definitely benefited from the preparation and the actual shooting of the events. Producing work for a publication makes one more aware of the details.
Lisa - As far as the magazine, I think I would be chasing pennies. I will stll give him a chance to tell me personally that I am not going receive any compensation for my work. I believe the local paper will pay me since I have a copy of my invoice, a signed stringer contract and it wouldn't be difficult for them to go back and verify they published my photos. I have just received an e-mail form Printroom photo services who stated that they are working to resolve my issue.
And all is not bad for me. Blurb photobook pulbishing has been very timely with their payments. And I have switched to SmugMug for my photo printing services. From what I have heard, they too deliver as promised. Just makes you wish everyone would. | | | |
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Posts: 1,838 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Dallas, Texas Real First Name: Jason Camera: Canon Can Others Edit My Photos: No iTrader Rating: 3 LIKES Received: 2 LIKES Given: 0 |
01-13-2011, 12:24 AM
Freelance work is tough. I've had a couple clients that took forever to get my money from. I've had a couple close up shop, but at least I was paid first. Sorry you had so many hit at once... | | | |
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Posts: 1,327 Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Austin, Texas Real First Name: Merrick Camera: Nikon D700 Can Others Edit My Photos: Yes iTrader Rating: 0 LIKES Received: 7 LIKES Given: 4 |
01-13-2011, 01:44 PM
I still have a $2k invoice due from November of 2008. Maybe November is a bad time to invoice....
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Tug on anything at all and you'll find it connected to everything else in the universe. - John Muir
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Posts: 1,984 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Plano, Real First Name: Richard Camera: Canon 20D iTrader Rating: 0 LIKES Received: 0 LIKES Given: 0 |
01-13-2011, 02:19 PM
This is a part of self-employment that I dread. I have often heard from small business owners that if they could collect all the money owed them, they could pay off all their debts. I knew a small machine shop owner who said that people owed him $50k, much of which he probably would never be able to recover. This seems an inevitable part of operating a small business.
My instructor for my Intro to Business class said that some of the slowest payers are the customers you would least expect. Big organizations, particularly universities, are terribly slow in paying their bills. The more clout and influence they have, the slower they are likely to be in paying their debts.
Last edited by Imagebuffet; 01-13-2011 at 02:21 PM..
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(#8)
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01-13-2011, 02:28 PM
This is why small business owners need to have a law firm on speed dial. Because most cases are dealing with small amounts of money, the typical attorney fee will outweigh the debt. PM me for info on how to collect debts for less.
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I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on.
I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them.
- J. B. Books
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01-14-2011, 07:57 AM
Require payment before work is released. Make no exceptions and you have no outstanding invoices. I moved to this model 18 months ago and have not had a single invoice go unpaid. If the client doesn't pay, don't release the files or final product.
When you provide your work prior to receiving payment, you forfeit 100% of your leverage. Even when dealing with companies with net 30 or net 45 payment terms, you can find someone in the area you're dealing with that can supply a credit card to use (either a personal card or a Pcard). The credit card holder can then be reimubursed internally via an expense report, you've got your money and the client has their product or files - everyone is happy. | | | |
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01-14-2011, 10:10 AM
This was always a problem back in my trucking days. You picked up a load for a broker, delivered to the customer and hope that you had used a good broker. At least we had bonds and at one time the ICC to help protect our contracts.... if all else failed we had Jimmy Hoffa too. | | | |
(#11)
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Posts: 1,838 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Dallas, Texas Real First Name: Jason Camera: Canon Can Others Edit My Photos: No iTrader Rating: 3 LIKES Received: 2 LIKES Given: 0 |
01-14-2011, 02:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by STP Images Require payment before work is released. Make no exceptions and you have no outstanding invoices. I moved to this model 18 months ago and have not had a single invoice go unpaid. If the client doesn't pay, don't release the files or final product. | This is fine for many of you who shoot families, babies, etc. You can easily make a retail client do this. However, he and I shoot for newspapers, magazines and corporate clients... places that just can't provide that type of payment schedule. I'm used to a certain Texas magazine taking 45 days to pay. A big North Texas paper I shoot for pays very fast, usually around 10 to 14 days (which is NOT the norm! They pay very fast for this industry).
This is just a fact of life with these clients, and there is no way to demand payment on an assignment that needs to be turned in the same day. They need your invoice to go through the accounts payable dept with two or three signatures first.
But, yes. I agree that many people on this board should do that! It will solve non-payment issues when dealing with a family of four that just had their Christmas portrait taken. | | | |
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01-15-2011, 07:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by janikphoto However, he and I shoot for newspapers, magazines and corporate clients... places that just can't provide that type of payment schedule. This is just a fact of life with these clients, and there is no way to demand payment on an assignment that needs to be turned in the same day. | Actually, there is a way to demand payment on an assignment. My comment was specifically in reference to corporate clients - hence my description of the use expense reports or Pcards (portrait clients don't use these).
I shoot for many corporate clients in addition to portrait clients. I have a credit card on file for each commercial client I shoot for, including magazines and other editorial work. If you perform ongoing freelance work for a client, they shouldn't have a problem providing you with a credit card if there is budget allotted for the project.
Most of the time, businesses use their operational budget funds for this type of work which is easier to access than capital budget funds because employees CAN use an expense report for operational budget items, but typically can't for a capital budget item (there are exceptions). It's just a matter of how comfortable a photographer is in saying "when you pay, I release the images to you". If a publication or business absolutely needs the images the same day, they can also pay that day; it's not a foreign concept to most corporations and print publications. Just offering what I have found to be true in my dealings with businesses over the past 21 years - YMMV. | | | |
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01-15-2011, 12:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by STP Images Actually, there is a way to demand payment on an assignment. My comment was specifically in reference to corporate clients - hence my description of the use expense reports or Pcards (portrait clients don't use these)... | Sure, I know what you are saying. I've seen marketing departments at big corporations use this sort of system, but I've never done it personally. When they've said, "Do you take credit cards or checks?", I always reply, "a check at net 30 is just fine." Now, some clients have asked me to submit an invoice two weeks ahead of the event, and they hand me a check onsite. This option will obviously solve the slow pay/no pay dilemma.
I've also had maybe two publications ask to pay via credit card in the 13 years I've been shooting for newspapers and magazines, so I know it can happen. It just doesn't happen often for me, which is fine. I actually prefer a check to avoid CC fees. One was a French magazine purchasing an archive/stock image of Dimebag Darrell from me. The other was a trade magazine.
I wasn't trying to say a publication would/could NEVER pay through a different channel, such as a credit card on file. My statement was more directed at what I've found to be a standard operating practice in the industry. | | | | | Thread Tools | | | | Display Modes | Linear Mode |
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