Texas public school teacher retirement question

[Howard Barlow]

My BIL's sister told him she had to sign an agreement she would not file for social security in order to collect her teacher retirement. Is that true?

[KJ Smith]

Originally Posted by Howard Barlow

My BIL's sister told him she had to sign an agreement she would not file for social security in order to collect her teacher retirement. Is that true?

Not sure about that.

There was a time when people in TRS did not pay SS.

So those folks may not qualify for SS retirement.

It was ~mid 80's when new hires began paying SS.

I don't see how people who paid in and qualify can be stopped from collecting.


Was she a part timer? Seems as if there was some sort of rule for part timers.
But you selected either SS retirement or a different program, not TRS.


TRS rules should be on the net somewhere.

[XtremePhoto]

My Mom falls under this. She never had SS removed from her check though and does not collect it to this day. She lives entirely on TRS and Family funds. If they didn't pay in, they cannot collect and I do believe she signed something along that line. Probably a formality. Can't remember. Do know that it all depends on her status when she was teaching.

-G-

[Howard Barlow]

Ok, maybe she had to agree not to file for her husband's, after he dies. Guess I need to ask him again. I can see where they would not collect, if they never paid in, but why would you be asked to sign a waiver for that which you are not going to get anyway (your own)? I know...gov.org.

[RexGig]

Public employees with some defined benefit pension systems do not pay into SS. I fall into this category, though I also work part-time one day a week in the private sector, and paid into SS at previous jobs, so I can expect a very-much-reduced SS benefit when I retire. The way I understood it, I could expect little or nothing from SS unless I did moonlight to pay into SS.

I never signed anything agreeing to give up personal or surviving-spouse benefits. (Such agreements may exist; I don't know.)

To be clear, I am not a public school teacher; I wear a PD badge for a living. I got my SS "points" several years ago, but my expected benefit will not be enough to pay our electric bill, most months.

Now y'all know why public-sector employees get really attentive when legislatures start talking about cutting benefits!

[rbalcom]

My guess would be, and it is only a guess, that it relates to the provision that allows a spouse to collect even though they do not have sufficient credits. A wife who did not work can draw SS equal to half of their husband's benefit. Both the public employee and the public employer did not pay SS tax because those public employers have sufficient pension programs that the supplemental benefit would not be needed. If the public employee took a benefit based on their spouse's it would be like double-dipping. I would guess that is the purpose of the agreement not to file for SS benefits.

[picman]

Social Security Q&A

Texas AFT - Support New Legislation for Social Security Fairness!

[Stargazer77517]

Howard its true, I have a buddy that retired from U of H and he did have to do the same thing. The retirement that they do receive is really a good one. I think its based on the last 3 years of ones income, so he is getting a paycheck just like when he was working and at the same amount. They also get cost of living increases which now a days is almost unheard of. That and what he had in a annuity, hes doing pretty good.

[ronocnikral]

Originally Posted by Howard Barlow

Ok, maybe she had to agree not to file for her husband's, after he dies. Guess I need to ask him again. I can see where they would not collect, if they never paid in, but why would you be asked to sign a waiver for that which you are not going to get anyway (your own)? I know...gov.org.

Husband's death benefit is EARNED, assuming he had his 40 quarters. While my SS reform ideas probably aren't best suited here, I would think HIS death benefit would be fair game, assuming he kicks the proverbial bucket before she does. I am sure she has some option to leave surviving benefits to him through TRS if she were to be the first to pass. of course, TRS would argue the benefits are to cover her expenses, and if he were to pass, she shouldn't need his surviving benefit.

My best guess is...even though some people who have TRS fortunately didn't get the opportunity to pay into Social Security, when a couple reaches retirement age, a spouse can elect to take THEIR benefit, or HALF of their SPOUSES (regardless of 40 earned quarters or not). Most people choose the greater of the two

The agreement is probably alluding to the fact that TRS "made up" for SS benefits and that filing for half of a spouse's would be double dipping. It may seem unfair, but I would take that deal in a heartbeat.

there is a disconnect between the state (TRS) entity and the Feds (SS). Either way, if the agreement was not to receive any SS benefit directly, doing so would be fraud in my book.

my 2 cents.

[ronocnikral]

Originally Posted by Stargazer77517

Howard its true, I have a buddy that retired from U of H and he did have to do the same thing. The retirement that they do receive is really a good one. I think its based on the last 3 years of ones income, so he is getting a paycheck just like when he was working and at the same amount. They also get cost of living increases which now a days is almost unheard of. That and what he had in a annuity, hes doing pretty good.

it should be pointed out that the avg 3 years salary is only part of the formula. I believe under current rules, one collects 2.5% per year of service. So, one would have to work 40 years (under the current rules) to get a similar paycheck as when they were working. doable, but I believe a small minority last that long. If you're buddy does collect a full paycheck, good on him!

compare that to FERS, which 1.5% per year of benefit is earned!! Not be confused with CSRS, where federal employees got the deal of the century, but people like my father in law still complain about not getting SS.

[Howard Barlow]

Thanks for all the input.

[mdparthum]

(Years of Service X 2.3% X Five Year Average Salary) divided by 12

This is the current formula for determining the retirement for Texas Teachers from the trs website.

Five year average salary would be the five highest years.

Teacher Retirement System of Texas: TRS (Teacher Retirement System Website)

[Buddha]

Teachers in Texas used to double dip. They would retire after paying into the teacher retirement system, only to be given a job with SS benefits which they would hold for a day. It was a gimmick which politicians and union officials still pull in other states. That gave them SS eligibility at age 62 or age 65 when they had payed in almost nothing. The state legislature stopped the practice, according to my teacher wife. My understanding is that any SS benefits from previous jobs or marriages are still good.

[lfmerrell]

I sent this link to a retired teacher. The identifying data removed and shortened as indicated by the ----s

>>How very interesting. That "signing" must be something new. I did not have to sign any such statement, but when husband signed up for SS, we were together, and since we are the same age , I asked for the spousal portion of his since I didn't have quite enough quarters to collect SS on my own. The SS lady said I could apply, but that my teacher retirement would be reduced by whatever I received from SS. Since applying for SS wouldn't really benefit me any, I chose not to apply. (I AM able to be on husbands Medicare but I also pay a premium for it each month.)
------
Thanks to the Government Pension Offset (GPO) whatever teachers receive in SS, whether spousal or their own SS account, an almost equal amount is reduced from their teacher retirement check. We don't even receive survivors' benefits. If our spouses pre-decease us, we are on our own, living only on our reduced teacher retirement because we were out of the workforce for so long.

That's one reason I am so resentful of Gov Perry's drawing his $7,700 monthly retirement while he is still being paid as governor. When I retired, I was told that I could go ahead and collect retirement and teach but the only way was to resign -- completely retire -- then if my field was in dire need, I could re-apply but at a beginner's wage (or whatever I could negotiate) with no benefits -- it would be a more-or-less temporary position. ----
I understand that TEXAS is one of the few states with that kind of retirement. Other states DO allow both teacher pensions and teacher retirement to be collected. I think now, teachers pay into both SS AND teacher retirement, so they may be able to collect both now. Don't know about that. I have suggested that they prorate the number of years a mom stays at home in relation to the number of married years when they retire. -----

I believe their reasoning is that teachers do/did not pay into SS so they don't deserve SS. They DID elect not to pay into SS back before I started teaching, so I was hired when they were still not paying into SS. I think some time during my teaching years, it became law that all NEW hires did not have a choice; they had to pay into both SS AND Teacher retirement. Those MAY get to receive both -- I don't know about that.<<

[Buddha]

Based on conversations with teachers currently employed, teachers can not pay into SS and TSRA at the same time, and it has been that way for over 10 years. Its a sorry system, but it is what it is.