Damn... (disaster recovery continued)... :)

[metagore]

Well, considering all the talk I've been putting out here about having a disaster recovery plan in place I should have been expecting this with my laptop now nearing 3 years of age... my hard drive crashed hard yesterday.

I closed my system Wednesday night and all was well, when I opened it Thursday morning it puked on me. It first failed to resume from hibernate, which happens sometimes, no big deal. But then it began repeatedly blue screening on boot. I ran some quick diags on the system and the drive failed the DST (Drive Self Test) instantly.

I'm not really posting to whine about the hard drive failure, I expect them to happen. What it did do is remind me of a couple other pieces of information I should share in addition to what I had posted in a previous thread here: http://www.texasphotoforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=36889

First thing is the DST. I don't know if this is true for any other vendor other than Dell, but the DST is a an indication of a drive failure... no if, ands, or buts about it. My wife had a hard drive failure recently too, but her's was under warranty. When I called for a replacement the tech wanted me to reinstall Windows and the whole nine yards. I had to educate him on what the DST is and what it does.

The DST is a hard drive vendor approved test. When the diagnostics fail a drive running the DST it 'flips a bit' on the hard drive's firmware indicating that the diags were run and they failed. Without going into too much detail, if your hard drive fails the DST, it will continue to fail regardless of what you do... insist on a replacement hard drive.

The second thing this reminded me of is another tool that I have in my disaster recovery arsenal... Knoppix!!! Some of you are probably going.. 'oh, yeah!!'... others are going 'huh?'.

Knoppix is a bootable linux CD that can be used to save your data from a hard drive that is in the process of failing and will no longer boot to Windows. It can be downloaded from any of the mirrors listed here: http://www.knopper.net/knoppix-mirrors/

If Windows won't boot, through hard drive failure or otherwise, you can boot to Knoppix. It will mount all of your attached drives, connect to the network, mount external USB hard drives, and allow you to transfer files. This is true even on moderately failed hard drives. I even had a major file system corruption where Windows would not read any of my images, linux read them fine and saved them before Windows ran chkdsk and 'deleted' them all.

Personally, I use an external hard drive for this type of data recovery. But you can backup to other internal hard drives or across a network to a file share. One thing to be sure of if you use linux with your external hard drive is that it is formatted in FAT32. Linux cannot reliably write to an NTFS partition.

Here's some general usage instructions for recovering data using Knoppix:

1. Connect the USB/firewire external HDD to the system and power it on.
2. Boot your system to the Knoppix CD, just press enter on the Lilo screen.
   You'll see a bunch of colored text and a happy penguin sitting up in the corner while it boots.
3. Once at the X desktop you'll see some icons for each of the hard drive partitions that linux detected while booting.
   The usb hard drive will have a USB memory key for an icon and most likely be listed as /dev/sda1.
4. Click on the icon for the USB hard drive.
   A window will open.
5. Then right click on the same icon for your USB drive and choose "Change to Read/Write" mode.
   NOTE: Only do this if you have formatted your USB drive as FAT32.
6. Then you should be able to go through all of the other drives (your internal hard drives) and open each one, drag-n-drop the files to the USB drive, and recover what's left of your files.
7. Once the files have completed it is very important to log out of Knoppix or 'unmount' the USB hard drive. Logging out will unmount all hard drives and reboot/shutdown your system.

Mac users, this is of no use for you. There are some people out there working on a 'live linux' CD for the newer Intel based Macs, but there's nothing out there that will work right now. For an equivalent procedure using the OSX installation CD for Macs please see srwatters' post below.

Not everyone is a computer geek, but do not fear the penguin!! He will save you time and time again when Windows cannot. I know Knoppix has rescued my data at least four times in the last two years. I'd recommend downloading it and burning it to a CD for a rainy day. And go back to the Knoppix site every three months or so to download the latest version.

Peace out!!! May your data always be safe and your backups current!

[bee]

good info. Knoppix has saved me in a pinch more than once.

[Jake]

Good info! Thanks for posting it.

[srwatters]

Originally Posted by metagore

Mac users, this is of no use for you. There are some people out there working on a 'live linux' CD for the newer Intel based Macs, but there's nothing out there that will work right now. This is a big downside to buying into a highly proprietary company like Apple. (at least for me )

Why would you need such a feature for a system that already allows you to do exactly what you are talking about? You can simply boot from the OS CD in single user mode and mount your file systems. I also believe that firewire target mode may offer some options as well. I'd also be careful relying on Linux to read NTFS. That file system is "highly proprietary" to use your words, and AFAIK still not safely supported in Linux (at least for read/write access).

Personally I have daily backups on a second internal drive, and a weekly on an external FW device. I use ChronoSync to keep my laptop files up to date with the desktop so that system is covered even in case of theft or destruction.

Disaster recovery is an important issue, but you shouldn't bash Macs because the hacked up tools needed for Windows aren't required. Best of luck rebuilding your system.

[metagore]

Originally Posted by srwatters

Why would you need such a feature for a system that already allows you to do exactly what you are talking about? You can simply boot from the OS CD in single user mode and mount your file systems. I also believe that firewire target mode may offer some options as well. I'd also be careful relying on Linux to read NTFS. That file system is "highly proprietary" to use your words, and AFAIK still not safely supported in Linux (at least for read/write access).

Personally I have daily backups on a second internal drive, and a weekly on an external FW device. I use ChronoSync to keep my laptop files up to date with the desktop so that system is covered even in case of theft or destruction.

Disaster recovery is an important issue, but you shouldn't bash Macs because the hacked up tools needed for Windows aren't required. Best of luck rebuilding your system.

I was not aware that OSX has a single user boot mode for the CD. In that case, the OSX CD can be used in the same as the Knoppix CD. There's no doubt in my mind that OSX is superior to Windows due to the fact that it is built off a 'nix kernel. If I could run OSX on whatever hardware I want, then I'd probably be using it instead of Windows. Apple could put MS out of business quickly if they'd just make the move and stop binding the OS to the hardware.

If I've bruised your Mac ego, get over it! . I did not intend, nor do I wish for this to become a Mac vs. Wintel thread. Thanks for sharing the article from Apple on how to do the equivalent procedure on a Mac. I'm sure that there will be some people that were not aware of this.

The NTFS driver for linux has been very reliable for 'reading' NTFS partitions for quite some time. It has even been ported to a commercial DOS based driver as part of Wininternals NTFSDOS utility, which does work in 'read/write' mode. So it is far from a 'hack'. For me, it has 'never' failed to properly read a file from NTFS that didn't reside on a failed portion of a hard drive.

And thanks for wishing me luck, my system was rebuilt within an hour after getting a new hard drive.

[HotHolly]

Thanks - wish I'd seen this post ages ago. Hard Drive failed twice right before Grad finals - papers gone, finals gone, all my baby's pictures - gone. We paid through the eyes to have about 3/4 of the drive recovered. I got my pictures back...and who cares about the papers?!!? Although, it was starting to sound like "the dog ate my homework" excuse. I mean, how many times can 1 person have such bad luck? I figured, a lot. We triple store everything now - not taking any chances.

Thanks for the post!

[srwatters]

Originally Posted by metagore

If I've bruised your Mac ego, get over it! . I did not intend, nor do I wish for this to become a Mac vs. Wintel thread. Thanks for sharing the article from Apple on how to do the equivalent procedure on a Mac. I'm sure that there will be some people that were not aware of this.

It's not about a bruised ego, it's a pet peeve I have about 'Internet experts' spreading inaccurate information as fact. I simply corrected your mis-information. I didn't bash Windows any more than you bashed Apple. In fact I use Windows at work every day, but I prefer the Mac for personal use because it works better for me.

[metagore]

Originally Posted by srwatters

It's not about a bruised ego, it's a pet peeve I have about 'Internet experts' spreading inaccurate information as fact. I simply corrected your mis-information. I didn't bash Windows any more than you bashed Apple. In fact I use Windows at work every day, but I prefer the Mac for personal use because it works better for me.

Originally Posted by metagore

Mac users, this is of no use for you. There are some people out there working on a 'live linux' CD for the newer Intel based Macs, but there's nothing out there that will work right now. This is a big downside to buying into a highly proprietary company like Apple. (at least for me )

I see what you mean. I did state my opinion here, so I retract this and will remove it from my original post. But the rest is indeed fact. There is no version of Knoppix available for Macs so the information I provided will be of no use for people with Macs.

[Hanky]

How do I boot a windows xp sp 1 cd to fix my xp sp 2.????? ?
Will it work? I downloaded Microsofts boot thingamajiggy for xp sp 2 but it
would not write correctly to floppies. I have 2 hd's I would love to recover.

[metagore]

Originally Posted by Hanky

How do I boot a windows xp sp 1 cd to fix my xp sp 2.????? ?
Will it work? I downloaded Microsofts boot thingamajiggy for xp sp 2 but it
would not write correctly to floppies. I have 2 hd's I would love to recover.

It pretty much depends on the failure mode you're looking at. If the hard drive is failing I would not waste any time in retrieving the information from that drive using a Knoppix CD. Once a drive starts failing every second that passes could mean further corruption of your data. Most computer manufacturers will have a diagnostic partition installed on the hard drive that can be accessed via keystroke during your system's POST (Power On Self Test) screen. (i.e. F12 on Dell) Run diagnostics on the hard drive to determine if it is failing. If the hardware is failing it will be detected in the quick tests in most cases.

If your hard drive is not failing and you're simply looking at a corrupted installation of Windows then you have a few more options available to you.

Most likely you can just perform what's called an 'In Place Upgrade' or reinstallation of Windows. This will repair any corrupted files and MBR (Master Boot Record). Information can be found here: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315341

There are other options available by using the XP Recovery console, but my experience has been that, on average, it's quickest to just jump to the repair install. The reinstallation of XP will retain all of your personal settings and program installations. You may need to run Windows Update following the installation to update any replaced files.

If you're unsure of the action to take, PM me with more details of 'how' the failure is occurred and what symptoms you are seeing and we'll see if there's a specific path that you need to take to resolve your issue.

[metagore]

Originally Posted by srwatters

You can simply boot from the OS CD in single user mode and mount your file systems. I also believe that firewire target mode may offer some options as well.

Since I'm "Mac-dumb" , can anyone provide more information on this method for data recovery? I followed this link and read it in more detail. While it does explain how to boot to single user mode from an existing hard drive installation of OSX, I didn't see a way to get to a GUI by booting to a CD (similar to booting to Knoppix). This appears to be about the equivalent of the Windows Recovery Console, which is not very user friendly and requires that you know how to do things at the command line.

How does a user get to a GUI interface by booting to the OSX CD without having to use a hard drive installation of OSX? This way the user doesn't have to dink around in the shell or know 'nix command line. Or is single-user mode command line a familiar environment for Mac users?

Since many artists use Macs, this information might be useful.

[srwatters]

The OS X disk repair utility is available when you boot from the install CD or DVD. It's operation is discussed in this article. The single user mode will allow you to do an 'old school' fsck. The original link was fairly clear on the differences and when to use fsck vs a safe boot vs the GUI disk utility.

This article discusses several third party tools and the Apple disk repair utility.
http://www.tidbits.com/tb-issues/TidBITS-707.html#lnk3

I think you'll find that DiskWarrior is the defacto standard in OS X disk repair, but read the reviews yourself to make the judgment.

[metagore]

Thanks Scott! I'm still learning. :)

I didn't get that from the first article. So it's actually the Disk Utility that you can use to browse (via GUI) a file system on a failing drive and back up the data to another drive or external device. To me the article read as though the only thing you could do from the Disk Utility was scan and repair a volume.

I guess it would help if I actually had a Mac to walk through the utility.

[engstrom]

Hey if the single user mode of OSX allowed me to do a dd command from the command line that's all I would need.

[srwatters]

The disk utility allows you to repair and mount/dismount volumes. It is a window GUI application that runs when you boot from the install CD. You are running the equivalent of the 'mini root' with Linux. Once you have repaired and mounted any disks that you want, you can use the finder to copy data just as if you booted from the HDD. Of course your applications are limited, but if the disk is repairable enough to mount, then you can copy files. It is NOT an embedded file system browser. The file system must be repaired enough to mount or the Disk Utility will not help. For that you need a recovery utility such as the ones reviewed in the comparison I linked earlier. Disk Warrior seems to be the best one from what I understand, but I have never needed to use it myself.