iso's

[Hanky]

Is it a given that high iso settings on dslr will look grainy? Is there any setting to adjust that would offset grain? I'm a newby and do not know about much but a salesman told me to use high iso setting for telephoto work. I like to zoom in on my pic's on the pc but dont like the looks. If you answer this I thank you in advance.
hank
i'm shooting a nik d50 w/ 18-200 vr, dx.

[billbunton]

The higher the ISO setting, the more noise will be in the image. If you're shooting JPEG you can adjust the amount of noise reduction used. There should be a menu item for this, but since I don't have a D50 I can't tell you where it is.

I think your salesman was trying to avoid spending the time to teach you anything. Use the lowest ISO setting you can that will give you a high enough shutter speed. What's high enough? Depends on the situation :-) Both camera shake and subject motion are involved. Since you've got VR, with a bit of practice you can use 1/50s, certainly 1/100s. If your subject is not moving then camera shake is it. If your subject is moving then you'll most likely need higher shutter speeds to stop the action, which may mean higher ISO is needed.

[fran reisner]

Yep, the salesman was either completely ignorant or unbelievably lazy. Bill's right... your ISO setting, f-stop and shutter speed are all a matter of choice and completely depend on the situation. What are your lightiing conditions? What are you shooting? If it's typical daylight and you're not needing to stop action there's absolutely no reason to choose your highest ISO. Without a VR lens (or tripod) the general rule of thumb is that your shutter speed should be no slower than the focal length of the lens. If that mean bumping up your ISO a bit to get to the right shutter speed do it. With a VR you have a little more lattitude. May I suggest, without offending, that if you are really new to photography you might benefit from an introductory course in photography. This would hold true for anyone wanting to step beyond auto settings. ISO, f-stop and shutter speeds would take volumes to explain here, but could be easily understood if you get "hands-on" in a class.

[epoh]

If you are shooting outside, start with ISO400 or thereabouts. Put your camera in shutter-priority mode (Tv) and set the shutter speed somewhere between 1/100 and 1/200. Take some photos and see how they come out. If there is movement in the photo, increase your shutterspeed. If not enough of the picture is in focus for you (you want the background in focus and it's not) increase your ISO, if you want less of the picture in focus (you want the background blurry) you can probably decrease your ISO, or just bump up the shutter speed some more until the f-stop is more like f3.2 of f/4.

[fran reisner]

Amy, sorry, but I'm curious to know why you would start at ISO 400? Canon is great, even at the high ISOs, but why give up your optimum quality if you don't have to?

[epoh]

400 was kind of random, lol. I figured it's in the middle, so why not start there?

[fran reisner]

Just keep in mind that your best quality is always going to be at the lower ISO setting. This is more important on some cameras than others, but a good rule of thumb.

[DEMDeepEllumMusic]

Since you are shooting digital there is no "film" cost associated with doing the following.
When you have a good hour or two take your camera outside on a sunny day in the afternoon and start with your camera at the lowest ISO that it offers (most likely 50) and take your fastest lens and go out and shoot. Start off with a subject that is evenly lit-no shadows being cast onto the scene- with full light and see what the readings are for that scene- probably should be in the 100th second and an F of 5.6 or even 8 which would allow you to try shooting at faster speeds of 250th and 500th second with a more open lense going towards a 2.8 or 4.0 depending on the speed of the lense (refering to how open you can get the lense to let in more light).

Since your digital files capture your exposure information you can call that info up when looking at the pics on your comp and you can see how it works out.

If you get into a light/exposure situation that puts you beyond the limits of your camera, say you can't open the lense up enough to capture that shot at the needed speed to freeze the shot then bump up your ISO to 100 or higher.
So your variables are: light; ISO; exposure time; F stop and how steady you can hold a camera.

The salesman must be a proponent of the "Photography for Dummies" school of teaching and he either did not care or did not think that you would understand anything more in depth than set the ISO high to use a zoom.

[sbp]

Originally Posted by fran reisner

Just keep in mind that your best quality is always going to be at the lower ISO setting. This is more important on some cameras than others, but a good rule of thumb.

I totally agree with Fran. lower ISO will give much more plesant output.

and disagree with fran that you have to take classes. if you on low budget then trial and error will work too. or reading works too.

I took little time. printed our few artical and study it and went on to manual from program. I am very happy now that I am shooting all manual. I agree though you will get more thing from going on training as you are either seeing live demo or testing on your own.

[fran reisner]

So we can agree that you kinda sorta partially agree?

I sure don't think a class is a necessity, but most work better and learn quicker when it's hands-on. F-stops, shutter speeds and ISO (and how they all work together) is not as easily understood in a body of text as it is when you've got a camera in your hands. And which combinations to choose when setting your exposure is learned by doing... learned better by looking at a light meter actually... (how many of you have one of those??) and also more easily understood with guidance.

[haraki74]

Learn some basics, especially from the members here then take your camera out and start shooting. With digital, you can see what you have done correctly (and incorrectly) almost immediately.

[sbp]

Originally Posted by fran reisner

So we can agree that you kinda sorta partially agree?

I sure don't think a class is a necessity, but most work better and learn quicker when it's hands-on. F-stops, shutter speeds and ISO (and how they all work together) is not as easily understood in a body of text as it is when you've got a camera in your hands. And which combinations to choose when setting your exposure is learned by doing... learned better by looking at a light meter actually... (how many of you have one of those??) and also more easily understood with guidance.

You right text is not easy at all when it comes to F-speed-ISO I have to read few time to just understand and to remember is different story. Once I got my L358 my life got little easier but still that knowledge of F-speed-ISO is a must, meter wan't do any good without that understanding.

[venchka]

Overlook the Film word & digital sensors behave the same way.

SUNNY 16 RULE
When caught without a meter, one can use the "Sunny 16 Rule" as a guide for exposure. There are two steps to the rule, as outlined below:


STEP 1: Set your shutter speed equal to your film speed.

(i.e., Shutter = Film Speed)

Examples: 1/60 for Velvia rated at ISO 50; 1/125 for TMax rated at ISO 100. Note that in most cases, the shutter speed will NOT EXACTLY EQUAL film speed, but will be set as close as possible to the film speed. It's simply easier to remember the rule as "Shutter = Film Speed."

STEP 2: Set your aperture equal to f/16 for sunny sky.

What if it's not sunny?
If slightly overcast, open one stop to f/11. If overcast, open two stops to f/8. If deeply overcast, open three stops to f/5.6.

How do I distinguish between slightly overcast, overcast and heavy overcast?

Examine the shadow detail. If shadows are distinct but soft around the edges, then it's slightly overcast. If shadows are not distinct, but still visible - very soft - then it's overcast. If there are no shadows at all, then it's heavy overcast.

The chart below provides a useful summary:



SUNNY 16 CHART
Aperture
Lighting Conditions
Shadow Detail

f/16
Sunny
Distinct

f/11
Slight Overcast
Soft around edges

f/8
Overcast
Barely visible

f/5.6
Heavy Overcast
No shadows

Ok, the Nikkor 18-200 VR mentioned in the beginning runs out of aperture at f:5.6. So, lets assume ISO 100, bright sun, shutter=1/100 (probably somewhere between 1/90 & 1/125 in real life) and aperture=f:16. Opening up the lens and speeding up the shutter we arrive at f:5.6 (wide open @ 200 mm) and a shutter speed of 1/1000. That will stop just about any motion you're likely to encounter. Depth of field of course is virtually nill. So you start juggling ISO/Shutter speed/aperture to arrive at the overall effect you need for the subject matter and lighting conditions at hand. If you're working on the 18mm/f:3.5 end of the lenses range, you gain an extra stop & a half of shutter speed or lower ISO. The three variables affecting exposure are interrelated. Close the aperture (go to a larger number) and shutter speed slows down (smaller number) or ISO goes up (higher number). This is where a handheld lightmeter with a round scale is invaluable. You can see every shutter/aperture combination possible for a given ISO and light value. Change the ISO and the shutter speed/aperture scale changes accordingly.



Clear as mud, hey?

Thus concludes the lesson for today.

Good luck!

[venchka]

Now, if ISO 1600 doesn't get the job done and B&W will do for you, for less than $100 you could buy a film camera and lens in the Buy & Sell section right here at TPF, load it with Tri-X 400 film, rate it at ISO 12,800, develop it in Rodinal and get results like this...

ISO 12,800

Have fun!

[markinvictoria]

Hi Hank, The D50 starts at ISO 200, I would leave it there until you get into low light situations. The 18-200VR has about a 3 stop advantage so you should not have to go to a higher ISO until you loose quite a bit of light. Wish I had that lens. Mark