Help! Suggestions requested: Shutter speed?

[dcnctx]

Group photo: The longer an exposure is, seems to add clarity and detail to a photo barring camera shake and/or subject movement assuming correct settings for ISO and Fstop.

Am I correct about this? (I can take the photo, I'm just hoping for the most detail over the entire depth of field, which will be a lot.)

Here is my question: What would be the safest shutter speed to photograph a long line of bikers (parked) in order to capture the most detail and risk the least chance for subject movement?

Planned conditions: Outdoor photo, Mid-morning light, no clouds with 18mm lens. Photo will have a large DOF. Tripod shot.
(If it's bright enough, I hope to expose at F22 and not less than F8...) I realize it's subjective.

Do you think a shutter speed of 1/30th would allow too much time for a biker to keep a big Harley still? Could I risk a longer exposure? I will be asking them to hold perfectly still just before I "click".

If it's a dumb question or I'm approaching it the wrong way, please steer me in the right direction.

[JohnT]

Shoot at 1/60 if you can. That will freeze any slight movement but should still give you the detail that you seek. Or even better, shoot at both speeds then pick the one you like better in post.

[kenw]

1/30s seems awfully slow for this, especially for a group. My absolute slowest in a situation like this would be 1/90s, but 1/125s would be a bit safer.

The larger the group the more likely you are to get a movement somewhere. The odds are just dead set against you getting everyone and everything perfectly still enough for 1/30s. One blink, twitch, fidget and it's toast.

f22 may be overkill, the DoF is very much related to your subject distance and I doubt that you'll need f22 to get sufficient DoF. It is more important where the subject is very close as in macro. For longer range shots, the DoF at f16 is going to be quite good, and f8 is as well in many situations.

Here's a link to a chart/analyzer to see what I mean:
http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

[dcnctx]

Thanks a bunch Ken, John.

I would normally shoot it around 1/125 and probably as close to F16 as I could get. I will be taking a few shots near or at these settings. I will be on a tripod and shoot mirror up, which may be sufficient for what I'm wanting. If more detail is possible at the slower shutter speed, I thought I might try it. The DOF; however, will be every bit of 150 yards front to back.

I'm thinking of the "Old West" photographs that have such great detail from their field cameras and silver plate. They often have great detail but usually at least one or more of the subjects blurred due to movement. I realize those cameras were a medium format and not the equivilent of a 35mm and that, of course, would have helped with the detail.

Perhaps I should rent a Hasselbald for this...

[Bruce M. Morris]

Actually the clarity/detail that you are seeing from a longer exposure is probably more because at slower shutter speeds for the same exposure you would be shooting at smaller f/stops. The only thing the shutter speed is going to affect is whether the subject is frozen or is blurred on the image because of either camera movement or subject movement.

Originally Posted by dcnctx

Group photo: The longer an exposure is, seems to add clarity and detail to a photo barring camera shake and/or subject movement assuming correct settings for ISO and Fstop.

Am I correct about this? (I can take the photo, I'm just hoping for the most detail over the entire depth of field, which will be a lot.)

[dcnctx]

Thanks Bruce. That's one reason I was hoping for an F22 exposure if possible.

I didn't know for sure how much the length of exposure lent itself to the detail in a photo. I appreciate you commenting on the f/stop and I do realize this is fairly basic photography skill, I guess I've never grasped if there is an additional link with exposure speed and clarity. Certainly it's all proper exposure for the best results.

So reframing my question: Should I expose at the smallest aperture for the greatest potential detail? (...with whatever adjustments to freeze movement are required?)

[DavidsStudio]

Originally Posted by dcnctx

So reframing my question: Should I expose at the smallest aperture for the greatest potential detail? (...with whatever adjustments to freeze movement are required?)

DC, the best aperture for most lenses is usually not the smallest due to defraction (or refraction - I can never remember which one) problems. Most likely, f8 to 11 will give you the best detail. It will also allow you to shoot at a higher shutter speed.

How much DOF do you actually need? For the largest DOF, you might think about working with hyperfocal distance. There is a good article on it in the dofmaster.com link that was listed above. Using that will give you the largest DOF you get with a given lens.

David

[JohnT]

Don't want to complicate things, but... Keep in mind, also, that shooting at f/22 with your wide angle lens focus set at infinity will give you a sharp and deep DoF from just inches in the front to rear. However, starting at f/16, diffraction becomes an issue with all that light entering such a small opening, bouncing around, and causing image softness. This may not, however, be that noticeable unless you start pixel-peeping or printing really large photos.

[dcnctx]

Thanks, David, I'll check out that website.
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Thanks, John. The print could be as large as 40" x 60". More likely a pano format.
The historical elements of the main street background need to be fairly clear.
The closest subject will be approximately 50' away.

[picman]

Handy DOF calculator here: http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

With an 18mm lens even f5.6 gets you a dof of about 5 feet to infinity.

[CaptainTom]

If you use AV, you can set your aperture at f8, focus on an object that is 8ft from the camera, and your DOF will be from 4ft. to infinity. Shutter speed will then be dictated by the amount of light and the ISO.

Using the Sunny 16 Rule and ISO of 100 aperture f8, you shutter speed would be approx. 1/500 sec. Plenty of DOF and fast enough to freeze any action with an 18mm.

[12stones]

Originally Posted by CaptainTom

If you use AV, you can set your aperture at f8, focus on an object that is 8ft from the camera, and your DOF will be from 4ft. to infinity. Shutter speed will then be dictated by the amount of light and the ISO.

Just be aware of how your camera is metering for exposure when you use AV so that it can properly gauge the correct shutter speed for what you want, i.e. matrix v. spot.

[CaptainTom]

Originally Posted by 12stones

Just be aware of how your camera is metering for exposure when you use AV so that it can properly gauge the correct shutter speed for what you want, i.e. matrix v. spot.

Or, just bracket the exposures like we did in the old days. Shoot RAW and you can't screw it up. ( well I could, but I'm not you).

[dcnctx]

<laughing> Thanks Tom. Oh I can and will screw some of them up. We are talking about bikers here. So I better do a good job and hurry up about it. (Don't know how much patience they'll have) Don't want to get a ride out of town...

Guess the old addage, "F8 and be there", still holds somewhat true.
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Thanks, Brian / Thanks, Ricky.

[12stones]

Originally Posted by CaptainTom

Or, just bracket the exposures like we did in the old days. Shoot RAW and you can't screw it up. ( well I could, but I'm not you).

LOL... oh, I can screw it up too, I just try not to show those ones.