Do Members Believe that the PJ Section be restricted similar to the Human Form area?

[Afragola]

I've been a photojournalist on four continents for the past 43 years: And the "conceptual elitism" displayed by many here is plain laughable.

The Paras' Prayer

Give me, God, what you still have,
Give me what no one asks for;
I do not ask for wealth
Nor for success, nor even health --
People ask you so often, God, for all that
That you cannot have any left.
Give me, God, what you still have;
Give me what people refuse to accept from you.

I want insecurity and disquietude,
I want turmoil and brawl,
And if you should give them to me, my God,
Once and for all
Let me be sure to have them always,
For I will not always have the courage
To ask you for them.

--Zirnheld

Go forth into the real world. Go out into the mud, the guck, and the goo of the world and bring back stories.

[JPalmer]

I'm definetly no elitist....but I still don't like good topics by photojournalists closed because of others inability to act like photojournalists.

[PeteQ]

Ah yes, with growth comes problems. This will be interesting to see how it unfolds. So many question about any change:
What constitutes a "PJ" who would be allowed in? Are they to be full time employed journalist? Part time? 5 published images, 50 published images? Or if one takes a snapshot of a newsworthy (define that also by the way) event are they now a PJ? Kind of like the "professional" thread a while back. There was a bruhaha about that even though the poor guys was using criteria developed outside of TPF!

And so on....


Sounds to me like a forum for a political free for all in the making....

<heads back to the sidelines to watch>

[JPalmer]

Crud...I'd be in trouble then Pete....75% of the stuff they make me shoot I wouldn't say is "newsworthy"

:-)

[brad]

Originally Posted by Afragola

the "conceptual elitism" displayed by many here is plain laughable.

Wow, I'm not sure what you just said, but it sounds rather insulting.

[Afragola]

Originally Posted by brad

Wow, I'm not sure what you just said, but it sounds rather insulting.

That could only be true should you choose to make it such.

I seldom post on this forum, choosing, rather to read, generally, with much amusement, the posts that can quickly assume absurd proportions here. "Should a topic be closed?" "Should a topic be open?" "What is this? "What is that?" "Don't discuss this." "Don't discuss that."

What, we should all eat vanilla pudding?

There was a time - not long ago - when the best photojournalism schools taught that photo and journalism were two words that worked together to form a synergistic whole. That a photographer, if she or he wanted to call themselves a photojournalist, had better be able to write - at least some - as well as push a shutter button.

- - before everyone begins the whirl of the dervish, let me say that that is exactly how it was taught at: Northwestern, U of Missouri, UCLA, Syracuse, Cornell, USC, and other schools noted for producing a huge proportion of the good and great journalist-photographers in the world today: now, remove yourself from the dither and...

...go shoot pictures.

Learn from your mistakes.
Profit from your successes.

But, above all, go shoot photos. And: learn to put some words with those photos.

Learn a language or two or three or more....

There's a never ending demand for your work if you can truly produce what publications - print, online, or otherwise - need.

- I carry a Roman coin in my pocket - it dates back to 300 A.D. - 1700 years!

Why? It connects me with those who have gone before us...

It's a big, wonderful world out there, full of art and museums and history and great food and fascinating and wonderfully different peoples. Go explore it and revel in it. Take huge bites. Go shoot pictures. Explore the world. You only pass this way one time....

[DEMDeepEllumMusic]

Great post Afragola and I would like the add the World can be Dirty and it can be Clean, it can be Kind and Evil, it can be Brutal and Compasionite, it can be Revolting and Uplifting, it can turn your stomach with revulsion but it can also make you cry out with joy and now people must understand that there are two sides to every coin and I believe that BOTH should be explored and shown in a good PJ section without worry that the photos will be censored or will bring unneccesary attacks for their content.

[johnastovall]

Yep, the Strawberry has been know to find an acorn and even a truffle now and then.

[Afragola]

And a Capa, Mydans, Eisenstadt, Bourke-White, Eddie and Ansel, Diane, James, and other greats of the past hug to you too, John. ;)

[lscottpht]

Ahhhh, the greats, but you need to add Burrows to that list and Horst Faas.

Oh, and just a side note, I went to Half Price Books yesterday and they had Black Star (what a great agency!) 60 Years of Photojournalism for only $19.95. Great price for that, and it's huge!

[Afragola]

Originally Posted by Afragola

And a Capa, Mydans, Eisenstadt, Bourke-White, Eddie and Ansel, Diane, James, and other greats of the past hug to you too, John. ;)

If one reads what I actually wrote one will find that I paid indirect tribute to them with the ... "and other greats of the past..." part of that sentence.

[lscottpht]

One did read what you wrote, and one was trying just to be nice!

[Afragola]

Originally Posted by Afragola

And a Capa, Mydans, Eisenstadt, Bourke-White, Eddie and Ansel, Diane, James, and other greats of the past hug to you too, John. ;)

And if one truly read what was posted one would have seen that it was a open personal message of thanks to John Stovall for his comments. Perhaps it would have been clearer had I written: "And a...and other greats of the past hug-to-you-too, John."

Since this has deteriorated to exactly where most threads on this forum do, I'll crawl back into my own little sphere, rather than to perpetuate a continuation of it.

[lscottpht]

Yes, one did read that, too, and again, one was just trying to be nice. One seems to try to stir up controversy whenever one posts, so one was just trying to add a little something not to be an ass but to establish a common bond for our love of the greats. But, since "one" chose to see this another way, one will be quiet now, too.

[Abel]

i dont have a problem with PJ photo posts... what i do have a problem with is when people began to debate abou tthe actual content of the photo itself and what is displayed.

we have rules here.... they are set for a reason..... period.

we have had flareups in the past over such photos and the arguments that followed and finally we had to invoke a couple of rules.

1. Religious/Political discussions are NOT allowed

4. Photojournalism
Photojournalism is posted for discussion of the photography, the methods used to acquire images and media credentials, and techniques of coverage. They are NOT open for debate about the subject covered.


Those rules will not change no matter how much theyre tested.... the only result will be that those members that decide to "test" and/or push the limitis of the rules will find themselves banned from this forum.

Some will cry and whine about "free speech" etc but I can assure you there is no such thing within these walls of the forum. Membership here is not a "right".... its a priveldge. If there is anyone that is not happy with the rules set in place, or how I choose to run things here, then I can gladly show them the door....

We go over this whole PJ and politics discussion time and time again. There is no other subject/content that requires so much effort on my part as a admin and our moderator staff... It is quite a disappointment that we as adults can not (or chose not) to follow the forum rules.

I am simply tired of people thinking the rules do not apply to them.... I am tired... It has gotten ridiculous. As I mentioned in the Offense Structure...

Eventually we will get members to adhere to our rules regarding this subject and/or we will have simply banned all those that have chose not to follow the rule. Either way the rule will be followed, it is now left up to the individual member to decide which route they take.