Partial image data loss issue. Suggestions?

[dbcann1962]

Howdy y'all ...

I've noticed lately that many of my images are having partial data loss in them. (Examples below from a news event I covered.)

At first it was just one out of say 500. More recently I lost about 20 images out of a 350 image shoot.

In Lightroom it showed a good thumbnail - at first. Then when I clicked to open the images ... I saw the data loss. When I went back to grid mode, the loss was showing there as well at that point.

Even in 'finder' if I look up the image, the thumbnail is perfect - but when I open it the image is shot.

I've tried switching cards (I use 8 gig Kingston Ultimate 266x cards), got a new CF reader, tried swapping cables, etc. with no change.

The other thing that really throws me a curve is that the shoot I did after the above mentioned 350 image one was AOK. Didn't lose a single image.

However after that I shot a few personal things and lost about half of them.

Any suggestions, comments, rants, etc would be GREATLY appreciated!

Peace.

D

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[JohnT]

Never mind. Just re-read that you're getting a good thumbnail, but the image is shot. Puzzling...

[MicWayWal]

Don,

It's your shutter. Classic issue.
Send it directly to Canon, do not pass Go, do not collect $200.
In fact it will cost you $212.00 exactly. Canon has a standard charge to bring it back to factory specs.

I shoot about 75,000 frames a year and so far this has happened twice on my 10D and once on my 30D. Found your exact situation once with my 30D. It started doing this a couple of times on a shoot. Then it stopped. So I thought the issue had resolved itself. Foolish me! Then 4 weeks later BOOM three pictures from the end of a shoot it came back with a vengeance. One image like these and then Error 99 every time I pressed the shutter. The other times with the 10D got a few images like yours; then nothing but Error 99. Off to Canon it went.

It only takes about 8-9 days if you send it to Canon directly and pay for it when you get in line for repair. Get your camera in line for repair by signing up online at the Canon site. Insure the camera,then ship it off to them. They will send you an email when they receive it, when repairs start, when repairs are finished, and when they ship it back to you.

[dbcann1962]

Wow ... thanks Michael!

I wrote to Canon and they suggested that I ship the 5D to them for inspection, so I reckon that will indeed be my next move.

I just don't know if I can survive with only my XT backup for a while though. :)

One more question, if I may;

I've tried (using the EOS utility) to bring up the number of shutter activations on my 5D and no matter what option I select it wont even give me a menu to show it. I'm thinking this may be cause I am on a Mac, but I'm not sure.

Anyone know how to go about that? I tried 'settings and camera' or whatever that option was - it would show my body # and owner name, that's all though.

Michael, thanks again! Your input is greatly appreciated.

Peace

[JohnT]

I believe shutter actuation count can be determined only on the 1D series. At least that's what I was told a long time ago.

[MicWayWal]

Isn't it called actuations?
Sorry don't know about that. I base my frames by the frame number along with the folder number generated by the camera. I only buy new cameras now. Digital camera don't reliably last very long these days.

[carrbowl]

Hey Michael, my 10D is giving me a error 99 and I have no idea why...I loaned it to a high school kid and haven't used it since then. Left my two backups somewhere and needed a camera so I pulled out the 10D and error 99. Suppose it is the shutter? Anyway to tell without sending it to Canon and blowing $212??

[PeteQ]

What you are seeing has also been linked to a corrupt Lightroom catalog. Have you tried viewing the bad raws with the Canon software? Before you spend $200+ on a shutter fix I would, especially since I don't see how the shutter can have an effect if the thumbnail is good and the images shows the full scene you shot. If the thumbnail was partial I could possibly believe it, but you said your thumbnails are good when viewed in the Finder.

Do you use one big catalog or individual catalogs for each shoot? Just curious as one large catalog will eventually begin to slow the performance of Lightroom significantly and it you have an issue you lose all your Lightroom catalog data.

And fwiw , there is a Catalog Preference that tells Lightroom to write the xmp files as well. I highly recommend this as then you have the individual raw adjustments with their raw file in the event you ever needed to recover or copy your files and use Bridge or send away a single raw with your adjustments intact.

[dbcann1962]

Originally Posted by PeteQ

What you are seeing has also been linked to a corrupt Lightroom catalog. Have you tried viewing the bad raws with the Canon software? Before you spend $200+ on a shutter fix I would, especially since I don't see how the shutter can have an effect if the thumbnail is good and the images shows the full scene you shot. If the thumbnail was partial I could possibly believe it, but you said your thumbnails are good when viewed in the Finder.

Now that IS handy to know! I'll try to use the Canon software to check em out. It was strange indeed that the thumbs in both LR2 and Finder looked good initially. Then after the image was opened and I saw the corrupt area and closed it, the thumbnails then reflected the image with a corrupt area.

In one case, and I cant explain this either, I opened the large image in LR2 and it looked fine. I closed it and came back later and opened it and it had a bad section as seen in this post. I assumed that since I had 3 shots similar that I had looked at a different one ... but now that I think back, not so much.

Originally Posted by PeteQ

Do you use one big catalog or individual catalogs for each shoot? Just curious as one large catalog will eventually begin to slow the performance of Lightroom significantly and it you have an issue you lose all your Lightroom catalog data.

I'm not well organized in LR unfortunately and probably should use different catalogs. I only use one large one. Time for more learning! :)

Originally Posted by PeteQ

And fwiw , there is a Catalog Preference that tells Lightroom to write the xmp files as well. I highly recommend this as then you have the individual raw adjustments with their raw file in the event you ever needed to recover or copy your files and use Bridge or send away a single raw with your adjustments intact.

That is a VERY helpful tidbit! Probably worth its weight in gold to me. I have Bridge too but have never used it. Seems just like an image organizing tool - and I can do that in LR2. (For the most part.)

Would you recommend using Bridge as well as LR and PS CS5?

Pete, thank you so very much for your time and valuable input ... thanks to all of you for your input! It's good to know there is a place to go when issues like this come up.

Peace.

[PeteQ]

I primarily use Lightroom with a separate catalog for each event that I shoot. After I have made my Lightroom adjustments I then copy the xmp files to a folder along with the already backed-up raws. As long as my names haven't changed I am fine as the xmp will fall into place with its raw.

I copy my raws to my Drobo and a separate external hard drive so that I have two copies at all times. By having the xmp files generated by LR I get all the adjustments without the overhead of all the preview data rolled into the LR catalog for my backups. For me it is just a safety in the event my LR catalog would get corrupted and then I could lose all my adjustments. At least then I could use Bridge and I would have a great recovery point.

[MicWayWal]

Originally Posted by dbcann1962

Now that IS handy to know! I'll try to use the Canon software to check em out. It was strange indeed that the thumbs in both LR2 and Finder looked good initially. Then after the image was opened and I saw the corrupt area and closed it, the thumbnails then reflected the image with a corrupt area.

In one case, and I cant explain this either, I opened the large image in LR2 and it looked fine. I closed it and came back later and opened it and it had a bad section as seen in this post. I assumed that since I had 3 shots similar that I had looked at a different one ... but now that I think back, not so much.

Same thing happened to me when I first opened the files. They looked good. But when I tried to rename them software would not work. Went back to the cards and now the thumbnails look corrupted. I tell you it is a classic symptom of a shutter problem.

Originally Posted by dbcann1962

Would you recommend using Bridge as well as LR and PS CS5?

I have never bought LR because everything LR can do Bridge can do; AND I didn't have to pay any more money.

Originally Posted by carrbowl

Hey Michael, my 10D is giving me a error 99 and I have no idea why...I loaned it to a high school kid and haven't used it since then. Left my two backups somewhere and needed a camera so I pulled out the 10D and error 99. Suppose it is the shutter? Anyway to tell without sending it to Canon and blowing $212??

Error 99 is the default error code when the camera does not know what the problem is by its own diagnostics.
Most likely it is the shutter but a couple of things to try first:
change your batteries
it could be a lens problem so switch lenses
clean the contacts on the lens mount and on your lens with an eraser or other VERY soft abrasive. Bad contacts can cause an Error 99.

You can send it to Canon to request a repair but not pay for it until you know what the problem is for sure. It just makes the repair take longer. I pay for it upfront to expedite the process.

LESSON: never ever let anyone use your camera. NEVER

[carrbowl]

Thanks Michael, but this was a camera I was keeping around just because....I wasn't relying on it for anything. Couldn 't get any money out it anyway!! I'll try a couple things and if it works great, if not so big deal.

[sjordan]

To me this looks more like an issue with the CF card or the part on the camera that writes to the card.

I say this because the images look corrupted, this does not look like a shutter issue to me.

I have had bad memory cards do the exact same thing. If its not the memory card, then its the cameras bus that writes to the card. A bad shutter usually looks like this but not with the odd coloring. The odd coloring suggest some sort of corruption of the image.

[MicWayWal]

Originally Posted by sjordan

To me this looks more like an issue with the CF card or the part on the camera that writes to the card.

I say this because the images look corrupted, this does not look like a shutter issue to me.

I have had bad memory cards do the exact same thing. If its not the memory card, then its the cameras bus that writes to the card. A bad shutter usually looks like this but not with the odd coloring. The odd coloring suggest some sort of corruption of the image.

Wanna bet me?

[dbcann1962]

SO ... I should have a Drobo by next week (fingers crossed) and the mailing label to ship my camera out just arrived today. I am SO glad I paid the extra bank for the extended warranty through B&H.

We should have an answer to this question within a couple weeks then. I hope. Maybe. LOL

HOWEVER ... I cannot guarantee that this is the whole issue, but somethin' happened yesterday that may toss a wrench into the sensor/card/card bus works; I uploaded about 50 images into Lightroom and got an error message on several images that said they were 'corrupt' or 'unreadable'.
I then used Canon's software to upload the images to a different directory.

The images that LR said were corrupt or unreadable were AOK in the other dir.

Now they didn't have partial data loss, they just couldn't be read at all. *shrug*