JPEG and youth basketball

[BEphoto]

Friday I have an interview/training with a youth sports photography company. They take action shots all around the area at different sporting events, then sale the discs immediately after the game to the parents.

All fine and dandy for outdoor sports right? Sure. ISO 100 and you can still get 1/1000 or so.

Okay, here is my issue. Of all the sports for me to get my "interview/training" for, it had to be basketball. Not that I dislike basketball by any means, it's just one of the hardest to shoot due to the poor lighting.

I have no problem bumping to ISO 1600 and firing away, going home and running them through some noise reduction and all is well. The only problem is that they shoot JPEG and the pics get cropped and burned on the spot. Are they just going to be noisy and that's that? Or should they (the salespeople) be running the images through some NR before finalizing them? Not real familiar with now NR works with JPEGs though.

I'm not at all concerned about my ability to get the shots, just concerned that the outcome, due to lighting conditions I can't control, may not be all that great since you are pretty much forced to shoot at ISO 1600 for indoor sports.

Would you suggest using flash? I don't think it would do anything to help my ISO since it would mostly be just a fill.

This is my first "official" paid photography job, so im super excited, but just dont want the pics turning out lousy.

Thanks, and any info is greatly appreciated.

-Brad

[CaptainTom]

Interview/training indicates that you will be working with someone from the company.
If so, I'd recommend asking them what they want and how do they usually get it.
If they say shoot at ISO 1600 medium jpeg, that's what you do.

[BEphoto]

From looking at their site, it doesnt look like the've done much basketball, if any. I cant find a single basketball pic on there. Hopefully they know what they are getting into! :)

Btw, tom, do you have a homing beacon that alerts you when there are new posts! You are always so quick to respond.

I asked the same question on POTN a few hours ago and havent gotten one response yet, which is odd for that site.

Ill stick to TPF and let Tom answer anything i need to know!

Thanks btw tom.

[CaptainTom]

As a premium member (or whatever it's called) I have access to LIVE
function that spits out the threads as they are entered...
Plus, I'm up late and there's not much going on.

[Roy]

I think there's different degrees of bad lighting....LOL. But really, one gym I shot at that is really old turned out to have some unique lighting. You just had to catch it at the right place and player. The worst I've ever had was at a tournament in a newer gym. The backlighting was a killer in that one. I almost wish I stayed home but it was a paying gig so I did what I could with what I had to work with. It was the same problem for any photographer. You get your opportunities and do your best. That's all they can ask from you. I try to get an okay from someone in authority before using flash. Lot's of times it's not a problem. Congrats on the gig. I really enjoy shooting basketball.

[John Godwin]

Sounds like it is time for some experimentation. Practice ahead of time to see whether you can use the following tips to your advanage in shooting JPEG's

I do not shoot JPEG so you might have to take this advice with a grain of salt.

Do what is necessary to set your white balance for the lighting available before the first assignment photo is taken. Remember that all indoor lighting is not the same, in fact some will cycle and getting a good white balance in camera is almost impossible for all of the shots. With RAW I batch process in Lightroom after the fact.

Do what is necessary to start the auto focus with your thumb and not your shutter finger.

If your lens has a focus distance limiter and you can use it then do so. No sense in the camera looking for focus at 5 feet if the closest action is ten feet away.

Shoot manual and over expose from 1/3 to 2/3 of an f-stop. This will help remove noise artifacts, at least it does for me. Take a reading off of the floor about 15-20 feet out from you and not have the reflection of the lights in the frame and adjust accordingly.

If you expect to stop most of the players motion blur shoot 1/320 or higher, 1/320 will not stop hand and feet motion blur in all cases.

When using the above tips with my old, obsolete and outdated 1DMKII 3200 iso is my friend and ally in indoor or poorly lit sports.

[BEphoto]

Thanks for the tips john. I shoot pretty much RAW only as well, so I'm used to having the luxury of fixing WB, noise, and all that after the fact as well. This is going to be a fun challenge trying to get everything right straight out of camera.

As far as AF goes, I've been a back button focusor for the last couple of years now. I lock up if I have to shoot with something that has the AF on the shutter!

I think all will be fine at the end of the day. It is a training session afterall.

The game is in DeSoto, and I hear they have a gym that's roughly a year old or so. I'm not sure if that's where this is going to be yet, but if so, hopefully the lighting is nice and bright.

[toverman]

I agree about focusing with the * button, it's hard to go back!

What lens do you plan on using? It takes more planning and possibly moving around, but I've seen excellent results with the Canon 85 f/1.8. Sometimes that little bit of extra stop can make a huge difference over f/2.8 in poor lighting, and the 85 focuses quickly.

Side note, but I used to work with a freelancer who used a 1Ds Mark II and his 85 f/1.2. Not really the best sports combo because he'd shoot raw, fill the buffer in a hurry and the f/1.2 can sometimes focus slowly. I don't recall his ISO settings, but he'd overdo Noise Ninja a bit and sometimes the players had a ghostlike effect. But this was newspaper work, and so there was some gain in the printing process that somewhat evened it all out.

[BEphoto]

When I was told about the job they said they required a lens with a focal length of at least 200mm, so I had planned on using my 70-200 2.8. But, that's mostly for baseball/softball/football I'm thinking. I agree that the 85 1.8 would probably be perfect. Unfortunately, I only have the 70-200 2.8 and nifty fifty in my arsenal right now.

I'd love to get my hands on an 85 before tomorrow evening but I'm super tight on money right now. :(

One other thing I did find out now though. These are not going to be high schoolers, but age 12 and under! So I definitely don't have to worry about fast moving action! I can probably get away with slower shutter speeds than what would be acceptable for fast paced high school action. Should be fun!

[chemisti]

If you have any of this equipment, might I suggest considering:
http://strobist.blogspot.com/2007/02...llege-gym.html

A couple of hotshoe flashes used with imagination can turn a 70-200 f2.8 into a f1.0. -Really.

[Ahh!]

Originally Posted by CaptainTom

As a premium member (or whatever it's called) I have access to LIVE
function that spits out the threads as they are entered...
Plus, I'm up late and there's not much going on.

Don't let him kid you. From the CaptainTom Cave, the Dark Knight has access to the mighty CaptainTom Computer, which allows him to see the posts while they are being made! It is our good fortune that he uses his powers for good!

Ahh! added 1 Minutes and 33 Seconds later...Double Post Merged Below

Originally Posted by chemisti

If you have any of this equipment, might I suggest considering:
http://strobist.blogspot.com/2007/02...llege-gym.html

A couple of hotshoe flashes used with imagination can turn a 70-200 f2.8 into a f1.0. -Really.

Personally, I like what CaptainTom said, but would go this route if I had to do a solo.

[CaptainTom]

Well, this should have happened last night but no report from OP.
In hindsight I should have suggested that he not underestimate his 70-200 f2.8.

It's my 'go to' lens for almost anything. I shoot studio portraits with it, as well as B747's. It's all in the perspective.

[BEphoto]

Shoot went pretty good. I used my 70-200 @ 2.8 the whole time with and without flash. Without flash I bumped ISO all the way to 3200 and was pretty damn impressed with the results when resized down a bit. I didn't run it through any NR because they wouldn't do that on the spot either.

It was pretty cool because the company had actually never done basketball yet so the photographer was there Friday just to test out settings. So there was no pressure on me to perform perfectly this time. I spent most of the time experimenting with stuff too.

[CaptainTom]

Cool Brad
You'll probably find that the parents won't notice what we consider "noise".

Have fun.

[BEphoto]

here are a few from friday. they arent perfect by any means. it was definitely a learning experience.



Nice Ups for a 12 year old!





I love this next one, but i wish it would have been brighter. I didnt want to do any post to them just because they dont get touched up when going to the parents. I wanted to try and get it right straight out of camera.