Bride & Groom refuse to sign model release form?

[wjmphoto]

Pete,

I don't approach it in that manner. I simply have contracts for everything that I shoot and those contracts include verbiage that I can use any images for personal promotion or display similar to the quoted text in the post above. If a customer wants to alter ANY part of my contract, that's the end of the deal. I don't negotiate price and I don't alter the contract.

I run it like it's my business because, in fact, it is. The customer does not dictate terms of the contract or my pricing structure. I am more than willing to walk away from the table at any time and have no qualms about telling the client so. The client either agrees to the terms of my contract, payment structure, pricing, style of shooting, etc, or they are more than welcome to seek out a photographer who is willing to bend to their whims. (I don't subscribe to the idea that the customer is always right or that they should get their way if it goes against your business practices.)

As I've said before, I'm not marrying the couple so I am really under no obligations to take a bunch of stuff from them. Hasn't been a problem for me yet and I don't expect it will be as I don't need the business bad enough to take a contract or assignment that I don't want to shoot after meeting with the prospect.

[WarrenG]

We generally discuss it with the client in advance, however we have the full copyright statement as a paragraph in our contract. We have had a couple of weddings where the clients were pretty adamant about not wanting the images used on our website....which was not a big deal, but for the most part...no issues.

If I were your client and you approached me with a "Model Release" it would seem to me that you were going to use my images, or try to sell them or something....which would be a big turn-off.

[PeteQ]

Josh, that's what makes America great, small business owners are allowed to do things the way we want. The more choices consumers have, the better!

[dcnctx]

Painting oneself into a corner limits one's ability to save face once the need is realized. America is a great country and there's room for many views. Negotiating has it's place in competitive markets, IMHO. I admire the fact that in this country people with opposing views are able to make a living, each just as well. On many occasions, I think it requires a lifetime to see which viewpoint made more sense. I see the logic in both points of view, however, I think negotiation allows the opportunity for more work for the businessperson. I'm sure it must be nice not to need to negotiate as well. The wedding party has rights, too of course and I can't blame them if they choose not to sign them away.

[wjmphoto]

Originally Posted by WarrenG

We generally discuss it with the client in advance, however we have the full copyright statement as a paragraph in our contract. We have had a couple of weddings where the clients were pretty adamant about not wanting the images used on our website....which was not a big deal, but for the most part...no issues.

If I were your client and you approached me with a "Model Release" it would seem to me that you were going to use my images, or try to sell them or something....which would be a big turn-off.

What you have to remember is that we are not talking about a full model release, when we are talking about the usage rights in a wedding or portrait contract. A full model release gives the photographer the rights to sell a photo and make profit from it and use it in any manner that they choose.

The release in most contract that I have seen, including my own, give the photographer the right to display pictures in their place of business, in sample albums that are shown to prospective clients, on your website to show your skills and in competitions. It will also state that niether you or the wedding party will sell the images for commecial purposes outsiide of print sales the the wedding party and their guests. It is also there to lay out who owns the copyright to the images - which in the US is the photographer unless they are stupid enough to give it away!

There should not be an issue with the client if you explain the "release" properly to the customer and if the clause is included in the contract rather than as a sepereate document handed to the customer after the fact.

[R & J Photography]

One thing we teach in our classes is that anytime you are photographing a client whether it be a model or a bride or a senior or whatever... get a release signed FIRST!!! It's all about communication..

Our contract reads:
The studio reserves the right to use images and/or reproductions for purposes of display, exhibitions, contests and other purposes. Unless otherwise specifically stated herein, images and proofs remain the property of the studio, and the studio has the exclusive rights to make additional reproductions from them for the client.

The "and other purposes" can be as broad as it needs to be...

We have only had issues with this one time ( the bride was a HUGE part of the Enron scandal), and of course if a future client has a problem with it we would simply discuss it and find out "why". It's not worth losing a client and a potential relationship over "wanting to show" images...

If you do this photography thing right, it should be a relationship builder... you shoot the wedding, then the maternity portraits, then the baby pictures, then the family, then the child as they grow up, then the senior portraits, then the child's wedding and it starts all over again... CUSTOMERS FOR LIFE!!!