Multiple Photographers at Wedding + Backlash - experienced peeps help!

[cmalana]

Holly-

Haven't been on the boards in a while since we've been incredibly busy but here's my advice:

1. It is time to go over the contract with the couple. The contract contains what has been agreed upon - no more, no less. Fulfill the terms of the contract (along with any extras you would want to give at YOUR discretion).

2. It is also time to come to terms that this couple is not likely going to be a referral client. Just get all your deliverables done on the contract and move on.

3. Review your contract language and improve it as needed. If there is some doubt about what your deliverable was, then give it the benefit of the doubt and just deliver it.

4. View it as an important lesson learned. Sometimes, loses can be viewed as 'tuition'. Again, just fulfill your obligations and move along. If they are the type of people that you've described, who would really believe them anyway, even if they started misrepresenting the events? If it came to that and they are not careful at how they state their 'bad press', they may have to be responding to a defamation, libel or slanderlawsuit and I'm sure they don't want to be in the middle of that either.

We've only had 1 'difficult' client (in terms of seemingly want to get everything for nothing) and we did exactly as advised. So far, it seems the matter is closed.

Good luck with your situation.

[lhdvies]

Holly-Holly I'm not a wedding photog and not a contract photog(crap I'm barely a photog at all), but I have been in sales and marketing for 48 years (and most of that on commission only) & what I'm saying applies to
this situation and nearly everything in life. If you don't respect your time, talent, experience and knowledge and the value YOU add to anythng you are involved in then noone will. From reading this thread I believe you should demand that respect from this "client" and move on. Apparently no matter what you do they will not respect your time and it (your time) is just too valueable for that. I have run into people like that & believe me happiness is their likeness in my rear view mirror. In the end it is your decision that you must make, but even though I don't know you I do know you are a too valueable to be dragged over the coals (so to speak) like they seem to be doing to you.-Sorry for the rant -just how I feel!-Good luck and keep the faith in yourself-Leon

[Wes]

Lots of good advice here.... I was going to say pretty much what Carlo said. Fulfill the terms of the written contract and then move on. These people will do nothing for you in the future. It's time to do what you agreed to do and then stop the bleeding.

[HotHolly]

Okay, thanks for all you imput. I am still wondering what is meant by "do what ever it takes to make the customer happy."

I think I need to talk my partner into dontaing free stuff to people that need it, rather than giving it to rude people that arent greatful for anything.

I'm enforcing the contract. I did last night and told her 2 changes only, as stated. She hasnt responded yet...

If anyone wants to give their opion of that phrase above, feel free. Ive seen it EVERYWHERE lately. The PPA has an article this month too about it. Exactly what does that mean?

[cmalana]

Originally Posted by HotHolly

Okay, thanks for all you imput. I am still wondering what is meant by "do what ever it takes to make the customer happy."

...

If anyone wants to give their opion of that phrase above, feel free. Ive seen it EVERYWHERE lately. The PPA has an article this month too about it. Exactly what does that mean?

The operative word is 'customer'. When someone starts to behave in a manner that suggests that they do not really find value in what you do and want everything for free, they have gone from 'customer' to 'charity'.

Maybe it's because we do not do high-volume work, but we are very selective with our customers. If their expectations are unreasonable, we will not sign the deal with them. If there is too much bargaining/negotiating going on, then they really shouldn't be working with us. We prefer customers that we have the potential to thrill so they can rave about our work. If they do not meet that criteria, they are probably better served by someone else.

As wedding photographers, we have a limited number of clients we can effectively service for a given year. It is far better to leave a date open than to sign a client that would be a bad match. Besides, you never know if a client that has a better 'match' will end up filling the date.

Our goal is to eventually only serve referral clients so we are willing to forego the short-term revenue/profit from a bad match for clients that see the value in our work and is willing to actively refer friends and family to us.

Hope this helps!

[photobykim]

I used to work retail and one time I had a customer call up the district office on me basically because I wouldn't "work the system" for the sale and pretty much give her all the stuff for pretty much free.

So district manager comes in and totally lays into me and says the customer is always right and you do whatever to make them happy. So I said if someone comes through the door they are a customer? Yes. If they pick up a bunch of clothes and walk out the door, it makes them a thief? Well of course. SOO when did the customer go from being a customer to being a thief? when they walked out the door. I said so how are they no longer right? letting them walk out with an armful of clothes makes them happy.

Does that make sense to you? When the client is no longer respectful and honoring a contract they should have read over and signed, they've become a thief. They're stealing your time and attention. They're stealing your goodwill and getting things for free because they're the customer standing in the store yelling loud and long waiting for you to let them walk out the door with free stuff.

I agree with what Carlo said when they no longer respect you and your business they've made that leap on their own from customer to charity.

big hugs and I hope it resolves itself quickly for you.

[HotHolly]

Thanks Carlo and Kim, and everyone else that has contributed to this thread. If this forum werent here, I'd cry!

Carlo, I agree with you 100%. This client was a 200% mismatch. They are interested in snapshots and we produce art. Since the groom came into the picture, we've gotten no where too fast.

Kim, I understand what you are saying about the difference b/t a customer and a theif. They really seem to think they paid a fortune for all this. I keep pointing out that they got this extra, and that's worth that. And they just dont listen or care...same difference.

I hate time hogs - they steal money and time. I would tell them to take a walk, but you have to start somewhere. Our 1st few clients were a mismatch, but this couple has been the worst - by far.

Thanks for your advice. I now have her complaining about the "meaning" of what she got in her contract. And she is still talking about conversations that didnt happen. Maybe shes nuts? sigh...

I hope this thread doesnt scare off newbies thinking about opening a studio. This is a RARE thing...nothing like this has happened before (in any job) and the only reason Im asking on here is these people are sticking like glue and making it very difficult to finish with them.

Beware of "bottom dollar" people...it never ends...

[Daniel Bates]

Originally Posted by HotHolly

Beware of "bottom dollar" people...it never ends...

That's why my package prices are about twice the entry-level rate. I won't get as much business, but my chances of encountering problem clients like yours are reduced a bit.

[HotHolly]

Originally Posted by Daniel Bates

That's why my package prices are about twice the entry-level rate. I won't get as much business, but my chances of encountering problem clients like yours are reduced a bit.

Very perceptive Daniel!

We actually had an insane price hike after we signed these people b/c I was so sick of bottom-feeders and their insane demands. A bride called the week after we signed this couple, and wanted wedding coverage, prints and an album for $120! I'd loose money on that deal...WalMart would charge more...

After that week of nuts calling us and wasting my time, I went for the sticker shock method and raised our prices an embarassing amount - and people went for it. We have less business (volume), but at least I turn a pretty profit. And I can produce art, not stinking snapshots. I just get worried I'll starve in between clients...

Junk like this means I get paid about 2 cents an hour, in which case I should move to some 3rd world country so I can survive. OK, now Im just ranting...

[Daniel Bates]

Okay, that wins the prize... $120 for coverage, prints, and an album? Sure, I'll send a ten year old with a 36 exposure disposable, get the overnight prints at Walmart, and put them in the cheapest 99¢-store album I can find.

[HotHolly]

I told you! It never ends! HotHolly's photography business is an on-going saga...

Hopefully it'll have a happy ending...

I get to do a shoot in Time Sqaure next week! The way things are going lately, I'll get there and fall down a manhole...I'm excited anyway! That could be fun. And at least there arent cheap people down there! I think meeting alligators would be more enjoyable, than these folks.